How crazy is this cartoon issue?

SD on 3/2/2006 at 16:04

What's this "state religion" bullshit, and what does it have to do with anything?

Convict on 3/2/2006 at 16:05

Do you use the term "Islamic country" or similar?

EDIT: You have used the term (http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1084483#post1084483) "Islamic country" and (http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1390177#post1390177) "Islamic state" and therefore you must equally condone the term "Christian country". Unless you discriminate.

It's significance is that if you are Islamic and in an Islamic country (state's official religion) then you have more right to say that something that happens is against your religion and should be stopped.

Paz on 3/2/2006 at 16:11

Quote Posted by Subjective Effect

1. Pics of Mohammed = HI I'M NOT MUSLIM AND THIS ISN'T A MUSLIM COUNTRY so get over it. What, am I not allowed to eat bacon either? Get out.

Yeah, this is just an 'unlucks, dudes' as far as I'm concerned. We can dress how we like too - sorry, that's not changing.

Quote Posted by Subjective Effect

2. Mohammed is being mocked = no, the mockery is of the idiots who choose to kill in his name AND IT'S NOT RELIGIOUS IN ANY WAY - IT'S JUST YOUR EXCUSE.

I think to say that a pic of Mohammed with a bomb sat on his head is 'not religious in any way' is .. well, just wrong. It's a pretty rubbish joke, but what exactly is the message if not 'lol those muslims and their bombs, eh readers?' Slightly offensive, not massively funny .. but hey, nothing to get excited about.

Maybe the intention is only to pillory suicide bombers, but it uses a brush which is too wide. This is, of course, just how I call it. We all react to comedy in different ways, obv.

Quote Posted by Subjective Effect

3. Threats to foreigners and burning of flags = HELLO, IS ANYONE HOME? A. IT'S NOT THE COUNTRY, B.IT'S GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH THOSE PARTICULAR PEOPLE. And just how is this going to diffuse the view that Muslim fanatics just freak out and go nutso in the name of Mohammed, when you are all freaking out and going nutso in the name of Mohammed?

Yeah, the people involved in this really aren't doing anyone any favours. That goes without saying.

I mean .. what? Can't they start an indignant letter campaign or something? There are a few steps of annoyance which have been missed out here!

Tolerance guys, tolerance.

Quote Posted by Subjective Effect

4. Jesus? Jesus is a Muslim prophet too so why am I not surprised that you guys don't draw satirical comics about him. BUT THE TALIBAN DESTROYED BUDDHIST STATUES AND THE PALESTINIANS DESECRATED JOSPEH'S TOMB. OH WHERE WAS THE MUSLIM VOICE THEN EH?

In a slightly related fashion, you occasionally see those banners with some wacky Bush/Blair caricatures on in various anti-West demos. Blood on the hands and all that.

I think that's fair game. Also not a great work of comedy though, I must say.

Evidently the step from attacking leaders in general to attacking OMG RELIGION is just TOO MUCH! Or, rather, attacking your own religion.

Maybe the art of self-depreciation is the most progressive policy of all?

Quote Posted by Convict

Isn't [Springer] a matter of trying to censure your own country with the state religion as your religion (Christianity), rather than being of a different religion to the state religion and being in another country?

Stront was over-egging the pudding a bit. There were no 'riots' surrounding "JS: The Opera" (to my knowledge). There were some protests, some media coverage and a bunch of Christian dicks who got the DVD removed from Woolworths/Smiths. This was also a MASSIVELY OVERBLOWN response. Albeit less MASSIVE.

Worth noting that (similar to these cartoons) there was no concern at all between the years 2001-2004 when The Opera was a successful London show. Only when it was shown on BBC2 at about 11pm with several strenuous warnings about the content (*gasp*) did it get any CONTROVERSIAL attention.

To directly answer your question, Christianity has exactly as much say in censoring British comedy as Islam or any other religion does. Namely; absolutely none. Unless the programme is directly breaking the law - which would be a different matter. Despite probing around the BBC Charter a little bit, there was no case against The Opera at all.

I don't recommend you watch it, because you probably won't enjoy it and may be offended.

I did quite enjoy it and was not especially offended.

Do you see how this works?

SubJeff on 3/2/2006 at 16:26

Quote Posted by Convict

It's significance is that if you are Islamic and in an Islamic country (state's official religion) then you have more right to say that something that happens is against your religion and should be stopped.

If the country is governed by religious law then yes. But otherwise, no. The UK is Christian state but if you think anyone here would be willing to be governed by religious Christian law you are sorely mistaken.

Quote Posted by Paz

You misinterpret me. I mean that killing in the name of Mohammed is not religious in any way. There is a world of difference between the way the Taleban ran things and the way Islam is supposed to work (according to the holy texts), in much the same way as Matthew Hopkins vs Christianity.

Convict on 3/2/2006 at 16:27

You've mentioned this Christian law business before SE...

I don't know of it. Plz explain. :confused:

SubJeff on 3/2/2006 at 16:34

You're not really that dim are you?

I mean a state where laws are based strictly on Christian holy teachings/idiology/The Bible. Of course.

Agent Monkeysee on 3/2/2006 at 16:36

I think you'll be hardpressed to find anyone defending this. Even StD thinks they're overreacting.

There was a quote on SA that sums this up nicely that went something like "There's no better way to counter accusations that yours is a terroristic religion than storming the embassy with guns and threatening to kill any European nationals".

There's just no excuse for this. It's ignorance and it's zealotry and it's bigotry. And the cartoons aren't even very good.

Paz on 3/2/2006 at 16:37

Quote Posted by Subjective Effect

You misinterpret me. I mean that killing in the name of Mohammed is not religious in any way.

Ahh, right. Apologies :)

I'll leave my post up anyway, or it'll look confusing.

VVVVVVVVVVV I guess "Songs of Praise" would be on tv a lot more.

Convict on 3/2/2006 at 16:38

Maybe you don't recognise sarcasm?

It is true that our laws are based loosely on the Bible (OT and NT) but to my knowledge there is no Christian equivalent of Sharia law and this also relates IMO to the religious texts compared (e.g. the NT is about JC's life and Paul's letters etc whereas the Koran is a lot about how to live).

Hence my challenge for you to identify what Christian law would be like.

SD on 3/2/2006 at 16:40

Quote Posted by Agent Monkeysee

Even StD thinks they're overreacting.

What's this "even StD" shit?

Just because I'm willing to defend Muslims from persecution on these boards when no other fucker is, that automatically would make me a likely apologist for any bigotry and violence committed by Muslims around the world?

You can stick that up your cunt.