*Zaccheus* on 10/9/2007 at 18:06
Quote Posted by hopper
I went over my original post again, and in no way can it be reasonably construed to have the meaning "it is illegal for a store to demand the permission to search you ...
That's exactly what I had thought you
were saying, and (
http://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1641828#post1641828) I said so at the time.
LesserFollies on 10/9/2007 at 18:13
If everyone is having their receipt checked, then I don't consider it "unfair." And as for changing things, it's not inconceivable that the end result of all this brouhaha could be them going right ahead and MAKING it a law that you have to show ID if and when a cop asks you, regardless of the situation.
Rug Burn Junky on 10/9/2007 at 18:15
And I feel sorry for anyone who would actually support such a measure.
But at least it would be debated, discussed and hopefully shouted down, instead of becoming a de facto standard because too many cowards are afraid to stand up for themselves.
LesserFollies on 10/9/2007 at 19:13
If you're insinuating that *I* would support it (and I suspect you are) you're wrong. There's a big difference between thinking it's silly to not show a cop your ID when asked and actually thinking it should be law. As for "cowardice," making a big fuss at a retail store simply because you were asked to show your receipt, wasting the cop's time and ruining your sister's birthday isn't my definition of bravery. Especially since he admitted he KNEW they checked receipts there.
Stitch on 10/9/2007 at 19:27
Quote Posted by LesserFollies
As for "cowardice," making a big fuss at a retail store simply because you were asked to show your receipt, wasting the cop's time and ruining your sister's birthday isn't my definition of bravery.
I find it depressing that people like you and fett have gotten so used to pulling down your pants and handing the system a tube of lube that you can't help but demonize the actions of those who unconditionally stand up for their rights, however minor said rights might be.
For the record I don't consider this man brave as much as stubborn, and I certainly don't consider this guy to be a hero, as the word is far too strong. A quasi-hero, perhaps? A queero :cool:
Rug Burn Junky on 10/9/2007 at 19:33
Quote Posted by LesserFollies
If you're insinuating that *I* would support it (and I suspect you are) you're wrong. There's a big difference between thinking it's silly to not show a cop your ID when asked and actually thinking it should be law. As for "cowardice," making a big fuss at a retail store simply because you were asked to show your receipt, wasting the cop's time and ruining your sister's birthday isn't my definition of bravery. Especially since he admitted he KNEW they checked receipts there.
Wrong? You're tacitly supporting it now.
All the "he shouldn't have been arrested"'s in the world don't make a difference if you keep stating that he should have just meekly complied with what was asked of him. You can't have it both ways.
And, to be fair, it shouldn't have been a "big fuss" at all, and wouldn't have if the store manager hadn't been such a colossal douchebag himself.
*Zaccheus* on 10/9/2007 at 19:49
It has to be asked why some people say he should have given the police his ID if they believe there should be no compulsion to do so.
nickie on 10/9/2007 at 22:31
As a slight aside, I read an article the other day by some geezer who thought a girl should have been prosecuted for putting her feet on a train seat (UK). The magistrates threw the case out. His argument was that zero tolerance for 'breaking the rules' should be pursued. He cited ex New York mayor Rudolph W Giuliani's policy of zero tolerance being responsible for the successful reduction in crime in New York. I don't know if that's true.
But it occurred to me whilst reading this thread that zero tolerance of being bullied by authority, which is what this seems to me to be all about, would be one small step in a rebellion which might possibly lead to less bullying in the future. It may have been a minor matter and it might have been at the wrong time, but personally, I feel increasing harrassment by 'authority' in virtually all aspects of my life and I reckon I would probably have acted in a similar manner.
The only thing is, no-one has ever suspected me of stealing, in fact, I remember one time when I didn't have enough money to buy a belt I wanted and they gave me the belt and told me to drop the money in next time I was passing. And that was in London!
LesserFollies on 10/9/2007 at 23:45
You know, I don't appreciate being called a coward by RBJ, and I don't appreciate Stitch assuming he knows enough about me to make that grotesque remark about "lube." It's too bad some people can't argue a point without resorting to personal attacks. It's shabby and it ruins the whole discussion.
Rug Burn Junky on 11/9/2007 at 00:19
No, what ruins it is someone who can't untwist her panties long enough to realize that I didn't call her a coward.
Unless, of course, you've been wrongfully treated like a suspect and meekly handed over your ID in such a situation, nothing I've said applies to you.
Now quit fucking whining, you're better than that.
