Vasquez on 17/1/2018 at 09:33
Yup, that's exactly what I meant -_-
The one who wants things to stop can - and should - also say "no", however in all situations it's not as easy as it seems when you talk about the principle. But if you're so clueless you can't read non-verbal messages like the other pulling away, then by all means, check every step.
Edit. Of course I'm talking about ideals. I do realise there's no way in hell that all people could learn to always be civil to others, and not use whatever power they have to do what they want to someone "weaker" (sex-wise or otherwise). In the end, it's not about talking things open or learning to read signals - good guys have always found a way to do things "right" - it's whether you really want to respect others or not.
Starker on 17/1/2018 at 10:48
There's a great opinion in the Guardian on the journalistic integrity of the Babe article and the issues that got lost in the conversation as a result:
Quote:
(
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/16/aziz-ansari-story-missed-opportunity)
Girls are raised with a contradictory set of expectations: be kind and acquiescent, but also be the brakes on male sexual desire. We are taught to reflexively say yes except for when we’re supposed to definitively say no, but we don’t learn how to know when we want to say either.
In the Grace/Ansari story, this dynamic was on full display. Grace may have been interested in some sort of sexual interaction, but she found herself turned off by Ansari’s actions, and communicated that to him verbally and non-verbally – pulling her hand away, telling him to chill, saying: “I don’t want to feel forced.”
In a perfect world, Grace would have walked out the door. But women are so strongly socialized to put others’ comfort ahead of our own that even when we are furiously uncomfortable, it feels paralyzing to assert ourselves. This is especially true when we are young.
When feminists do try to talk about this sexual imbalance, we get written off as anti-sex prudes. This is strange, because what we actually want is a norm of good sex for everyone involved, instead of the status quo of sex as a male-led endeavor, centered on male pleasure. Women seem to have two sexual possibilities: yes or no. Note that men never have to say “no means no” or even “yes means yes”. They’re the ones posing the question, not answering it.
Men aren’t morons, and they know as well as anyone that a woman who is silent, physically stiff, or pulling away is not exactly aflame with desire. But they also know that we are collectively invested in a social script wherein men push to get sex until women acquiesce. And so they push, even when they know it’s unwelcome, because they can.
The language of “a bad hookup” fails to capture the unequal power dynamics and the deep sense of disorientation and betrayal that comes when someone treats you as a hole rather than a person. Nor does it adequately measure the weight of centuries of misogyny that have shaped our most intimate moments.
icemann on 17/1/2018 at 16:33
The other challenge is that some women can be quite contradictory. Saying no, but in actual fact are playing hard to get on purpose. And your supposed to psychically work that out. This obviously varies from female to female, but can be tricky to figure out at times. Obviously if she's saying a big loud no + making obvious negative body language then it's easy to know that that no is really a no, but other times things can be not so clear cut. And therein lies the dilemma.
Kolya on 17/1/2018 at 16:49
Those are never worth it anyway, so ye might just take that 'no' literally and move on to greener pastures. The spared misunderstandings will just be a bonus to your not-broken heart.
As a wise man once said to me: Find yourself a nice girl that likes to put out.
Vasquez on 17/1/2018 at 17:10
What Kolya said. Also, if she's playing hard to get and you don't seem to bother with the chase and guessing-game, she'll come after you and then you'll know for sure ;)
SubJeff on 17/1/2018 at 22:11
Quote Posted by Starker
Note that men never have to say “no means no” or even “yes means yes”.
wat a crock
Kolya on 17/1/2018 at 23:06
Seriously, I have to yell that every 5min. She still forces her ass in my face and then sits on the keyboaasdhjlöasjm,asssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssgoddammit!
#thering #meowtoo #queenofcorona
Renzatic on 17/1/2018 at 23:34
All I want is a woman who'll make me pancakes, then rub my belly after I'm done eating them.
SubJeff on 18/1/2018 at 19:50
Got to say, I'm pretty surprised about the hate Azis is getting itt.
Renzatic on 18/1/2018 at 19:56
I won't say I hate him, or that he's ultimately guilty of anything, but if the alleged is true, he could've handled himself with a lot more class and tact.