Hogwash on 24/6/2008 at 12:49
I'm about to finally ditch my old 17" CRT that has kept me going through all those years of sneaking around in the dark up till now.
However, one of the things that concerns me about getting a TFT LCD is the contrast level - a lot of the monitors around don't so much have blacks as 'dark greys', largely due to the back light and inherent limitations of the technology itself. This is especially noticeable in a completely dark room, and we all know that this is the best way to play Thief.
Does anyone have any flat screen monitors that play perfectly well in the dark, where blacks look black and you can make out the shadow detail? I will be getting a 24" screen so if anyone has a monitor of that size that works well for dark games I would be interested to know the model.
I just want to make sure that when I am able to fire up the Dark Mod and replay through TDP/TMA/TDS on my new PC that everything doesn't look 'muddy', as it is often called.
So basically, how does Thief play on your flat screen?
bikerdude on 24/6/2008 at 13:35
Quote Posted by Hogwash
I'm about to finally ditch my old 17" CRT that has kept me going through all those years of sneaking around in the dark up till now.
Most good 24' will cost upwards of £400, if you want something that has been specifically bought and tested with thief in mind then I suggest the "NEC 20wgx2 Pro"
It has the best blacks(using the dynamic level) of any 20" lcd that I have come accross in the last 2yrs, the backlighting is uniform (which is also key to a good thief playing session), the colours are predictabley good (waaaay better than your crt), the refresh rate is low enough that you wont see any jitter/lag in games, the text/gfx are very sharp (the screen is a S-IPS type), the viewing angel is almost as good as a crt (and far better than 90% of LCD's out there)
The only fly in the ointlment is the price.... £300inc vat new, but thats what you pay for one of the, if not the best 20" lcd monitor's on the market today. You also have the NEC 20wgx2 (non pro) which is almost as good as the pro but £80-100 cheaper.
Hogwash, I see that your only 15mins from where I live, come round and see for yourself, Ive got all 3 thief games. Ive sent you a PM/email as I have something that may interest you.
biker
Wille on 24/6/2008 at 14:38
Hmm you raised my interest too Bikerdude, that NEC sounds very good. But do you have any idea how old technology it has? I would like to buy it if there's something new and better coming soon then I'll wait.
bikerdude on 24/6/2008 at 14:44
Quote Posted by Wille
Hmm you raised my interest too Bikerdude, that NEC sounds very good. But do you have any idea how old technology it has? I would like to buy it if there's something new and better coming soon then I'll wait.
a year ago I had £400 to spend on a new screen, I tested via (the 7day distance selling act here in the UK) 6 monitors, LG ( 20"), 2x Samsung (20" and 22"), Hp (20" ), 2x Dell(20") the NEC easily beat the others - it had better black levels, viewing angles, sharpness, backlight uniformity, refresh rate, the Dell 20" was closest to the NEC but had a weird viewing angel issue. The LG, SSung, Hp, were all £150-180, the Dell £240. and the NEC £290.
It came out in 2006, Look up S-IPS - you will find all the very best monitors use that type of screen. Dell's new 30' monster is S-IPS :-D if I had £1000 I would have one of those beasties.
biker
PS. If Enough people ask, I will do a mini review of thief 2/3 on my NEC and compar it to my old Dell 17" LCD
Hogwash on 24/6/2008 at 15:15
Thanks for the information. Unfortunately, Bikerdude, I'm no longer living in St Albans. This is my first post for a few years!
Interesting that the NEC is a S-IPS panel as you don't usually get anything other than TN at that size, although that explains the high price I guess. Personally, I am willing to spend good money if the monitor is worth it, and as I am getting a completely new PC I want to go to 24" for the 1920 x 1200 resolution for future proofing.
I've pretty much discounted TNs as their viewing angles are poor. So basically, I'm looking for a 24" *VA or S-IPS panel monitor that has low input lag, good contrast and good response time. A lot to ask in this industry, I know. The Digimate/Yuraku/Iolair budget ones that are going round are meant to be good value for £200, but the black levels aren't great.
It's a pain as each size/type has different pros and cons.
pavlovscat on 24/6/2008 at 15:48
Check out (
http://www.viewsoniceurope.com/UK/Products/LCDX/VX2435wm.htm) http://www.viewsoniceurope.com/UK/Products/LCDX/VX2435wm.htm. I have a VX922 (only 19") which is over a year old. I have no glare problems, even in full sun, 2ms response times, nice dark blacks and good shadowing. I've been using ViewSonic for years, but this is my first LCD. I held off getting one for the same reasons you are hesitating. I am absolutely happy with my monitor. The VX series is good. The VP series is amazing but pricey.
bikerdude on 24/6/2008 at 16:00
Quote Posted by Hogwash
Thanks for the information. Unfortunately, Bikerdude, I'm no longer living in St Albans. This is my first post for a few years! Interesting that the NEC is a S-IPS panel as you don't usually get anything other than TN at that size, although that explains the high price I guess. I want to go to 24" for the 1920 x 1200 resolution for future proofing..
So where you located now? and to be blunt 95% of gfx cards arent capable of playing games @ 1920*1200, the happy medium is 1680*1050 which is what all 20" monitors do.
ps. have you checked your pm's
biker
Calibrator on 25/6/2008 at 17:29
Quote Posted by Bikerdude
and to be blunt 95% of gfx cards arent capable of playing games @ 1920*1200, the happy medium is 1680*1050 which is what all 20" monitors do.
He can use two Geforce 280 with that kind of resolution to get usable frame rates with the latest and "greatest" games.
But I wouldn't consider such a setup "future-proof" - a monitor with such a res is a good guarantee for regular spendings to get better graphics cards.
Calibrator
Hiatus on 26/6/2008 at 10:42
Quote Posted by Bikerdude
PS. If Enough people ask, I will do a mini review of thief 2/3 on my NEC and compar it to my old Dell 17" LCD
I am interested in such a review, biker. Hope other taffers on the verge of lcd buy will express their interest, as well :).
Hogwash on 1/7/2008 at 12:49
I'd be interested in a review, Bikerdude. I'm tempted by this monitor, and might be prepared to sacrifice a larger size and resolution if the image quality was worth it.
During my research on the black levels of TFTs, I've come across this:
Inline Image:
http://ded.zenblue.net/crt_left_lcd_right_blacktestrs.jpgThe one on the left is a CRT, the right is an NEC 20WMGX2 with 1600:1 contrast. The difference is quite distinct, and I'd hate to see what some of those budget monitors look like.
Bikerdude, how does your Pro monitor compare to the one above? If you could take pics as part of your 'mini review' I would appreciate it. I know you've tested several different screens and that you play the Thief games in the dark, so if you're happy enough then I guess that comes as a glowing recommendation.
