Durinda D'Bry on 15/6/2005 at 07:43
Dark Arrow Which one would be smaller: .unr files with the extra files added to folders in the .zip with the .unr file, or .IBT files and only those files that are not in the .IBT file.
I assumed we would be using .unr files and then have the loader pogram convert the .unr files to the IBT file that Thief 3 wants.
UNR is format just for editor. It would be very hard to convert it to IBT because of complexity. Probably this would be optimal solution to write standalone converter from "GMP+resources" to "IBT". But we don't know details about GMP format (as well as UNR), right? Unfortunately all that developers left for us is similar converter tightly embedded to game engine (activated by "write to block files" option).
Dark Arrow on 15/6/2005 at 15:10
Is there any possible way we could make the loader program run the converter? I am not a programmer, so I don't know if this would be even possible (or let alone a method worth working for).
SneaksieDave on 15/6/2005 at 17:05
I'm closer to the sentiment that it's really not that big of a deal. And I'm on dialup, so I'm not speaking from a broadband perspective. Broadbanders shouldn't be bothered at all. So an FM takes you 15 minutes to get, instead of 3. So, what's the rush? Go get a sammich or practice having patience or something.
If archival size is a concern, that's what hosts and CD/DVDROMs are for, not your hard drive. Stuff is getting bigger, and that will always be the case.
I'm okay with any method, but I lean toward an FM package being an FM package, and being everything needed, nothing more, nothing less, mostly because I think telling people they need the editor installed and need to build IBTs themselves, is going to be a deal breaker for the majority of players.
epithumia on 15/6/2005 at 17:58
It doesn't seem to bother current FM players that they have to download and run Darkloader so that it can, say, run the converter to make the MP3 files usable in the game. As long as the FM players don't have to do anything besides download the FM-installer and its prerequisites, download some FMs and click "play", I don't think it will matter to anyone what happens under the hood.
BTW, I will say that as someone who will be hosting these FMs, it would certainly matter to me if it takes 15 minutes instead of 3, because five times the bandwidth requirement is certainly going to be felt.
Ziemanskye on 15/6/2005 at 19:13
Quote Posted by epithumia
BTW, I will say that as someone who will be hosting these FMs, it would certainly matter to me if it takes 15 minutes instead of 3, because five times the bandwidth requirement is certainly going to be felt.
That's why I didn't submit my map to you - I figure if your hosting these you should be hosting the ones that are (A) finished, and (B) good, or (C) available only as bittorrent with you tracking (if that's any better than - I don't know how that works, or what kind of bandwidth it eats), rather than necessarily hosting the whole thing.
20-30Mb per map, per dl is going to rack up very quick.
OrbWeaver on 15/6/2005 at 20:37
Quote Posted by Dark Arrow
Is there any possible way we could make the loader program run the converter? I am not a programmer, so I don't know if this would be even possible (or let alone a method worth working for).
That is actually quite a good idea, since the IBT is generated by the game itself. Assuming that the GMP plus all necessary resources were installed in their correct locations, the loader could:
1. Set WriteResourceBlockFiles=True in default.ini
2. Call the game to start the mission. The user could be warned that the first load will be slow but subsequent loads should be much faster.
3. After the game quits, reset WriteResourceBlockFiles=False in the default.ini
This assumes that having WriteResourceBlockFiles=True won't affect the ability to actually play the misson. An even better solution would be to use the command line option that Harwin suggested was available to generate the IBT's without adjusting the config files, if anyone could find out what it was.
Ziemanskye on 15/6/2005 at 20:41
The problem with that Orb is that it guarantees you need the editor, and that the program has to move and backup all of your stuff anyway. Every new script is added to the editor sequentially, so my TS_4271 is not going to be the same as New Horizons...
Might still work out I guess. I'm no programmer either, but moving what's already there about is probably easier than creating new compile tools.
epithumia on 15/6/2005 at 22:44
Quote Posted by Ziemanskye
That's why I didn't submit my map to you
Well, you should feel free to do so if you need the hosting. At this point we all know that T3 FMs aren't ready for prime time and so I'm not yet adding them to the main archive, but I have no problem giving the files a place.
Quote Posted by Ziemanskye
20-30Mb per map, per dl is going to rack up very quick.
That's no different than any other mission. I'm prepared to handle the load; I just want to make sure that folks realize that there's more to the size issue than just a little extra download time.
Ziemanskye on 15/6/2005 at 22:55
That's very reassuring epithumia, thank you, though a large part of it why I wasn't is simply personal arrogance - I didn't want to occupy your space with substandard work. Maybe once the kinks are out, and we can have an archived complete mission. Or sooner, depending on how many other people end up having trouble with rapidshare.
epithumia on 15/6/2005 at 23:07
Quote Posted by Ziemanskye
I didn't want to occupy your space with substandard work.
Which begs the question: have you seen the early stuff in the thiefmissions archive?
