zacharias on 13/6/2016 at 05:57
Hahaha..that's beautiful that I've narked you into such a lengthy, irrelevant and plain wrong response.
I'll keep this relatively brief, as we've already derailed the thread enough.
i) I have never defended Hodgson. He's crap, and out of his depth. I've already stated this in this very thread.
ii) The english league has declined a bit in the last few years. The best players left, and you can see the overall decline in Champions League displays. (Let's see how long you still have 4 spots).
iii) Isn't it a bit odd that English players have won and continue to win everything there is to win at club level, while utterly failing at international level? The alleged lack of technical ability doesn't seem to be a hindrance at club level, does it?Christ. You really can't be this thick. The clubs are stacked with more talented, more technical (and cheaper) foreign players.
iv) You implied that all England needed was a decent manager for success. Sven was not really past his prime when he took over, he'd had very recent success with Lazio.
NB. The FA are certainly a useless bunch, but that's not the whole extent of the problem.
v) This whole Gerrard love is completely irrelevant. He's your hero as an ardent Liverpool fan. Fine. To be the best midfielder in world football though you should be a gifted technical playmaker up there with the likes of Zidane, Pirlo, Xavi, Iniesta. I simply don't see that level of technique with Gerrard. (Scholes was closer to those players.) I mean you're quoting Gattuso and Pele. Gattuso, i mean wtf who even cares what that clown thinks? And everyone knows Pele was a great player who talks an awful lot of shit about football (e.g. 'Neymar is better than Messi').
That's probably enough..sorry for the derail folks..
SD on 13/6/2016 at 11:38
It's not a derail to talk about football in a football thread, and the only thing you should be apologising for is for writing such fatuous nonsense about football for more than a decade.
Good to see you finally admit that Hodgson is useless. Now all I need to do is to get you to admit that his uselessness has an impact on the performance of the England side and you'll have done a complete 180.
You seem to think it's enough to bang on about how foreign players are "more technical" without even elucidating what that's supposed to mean, or providing evidence for your assertion.
Gerrard isn't my "hero", I'm not even that keen on the man personally. However his quality cannot be denied.
Funny how you cite Zidane, Pirlo et al as examples of more technically gifted players while the Zidanes and Pirlos of the world are praising Gerrard as their technical equal. I mean, that really says it all about the level of claptrap I'm dealing with here.
One day England will get a decent coach and then they'll start winning things and I will be proven right yet again. Unfortunately I think we'll probably have to wait another decade just like we've had to wait a decade for me to be proven right about Gerrard.
zacharias on 13/6/2016 at 12:50
It is a bit of a derail because you're quoting half a page on a player who isn't in Euro 2016 (the subject of this thread).
So I 'finally admit' that Hodgson is useless? As I just said, I've always said Woy is crap. Suggest you re-read the thread.
It's pretty obvious what 'technical' means. Ability to control and receive the ball at speed, pass the ball with extreme accuracy, shooting ability and close control dribbling at speed. Ability to bamboozle opponents, do something unexpected or unique. England are mostly pedestrian.
Let's return to Gerrard. Where are these articles where Zidane or Pirlo have stated Gerrard was their technical equal? A lot of players praise other players in interviews but it really means fuck all compared to what happens on the pitch. So I prefer to make a judgement with my own eyes. Pirlo absolutely pissed on Gerrard when they met at Euro 2012, the gulf in class was embarrassing. If you think Gerrard was Zidanes equal technically, you are simply delusional.
For you to have been 'proven right' about Gerrard, he would have had to have been proven to be the best/most complete midfielder around 2006 and for a substantial period of the last decade. And that's simply not the case at all. I'd say Zidane and then Ronaldhino (brief period) were considered the best in the early 2000s, and Xavi's success with Barca and Spain (4 CL in 10 years, 1 WC, 2 Euros) is miles and miles ahead of anything Gerrard achieved 2006-16 and would suggest he was a far better and more complete midfielder (you could also substitute Iniesta here).
So your Gerrard 'I was proven right' assertion is complete and utter balls.
I would also suggest you'll be waiting more than a decade for England to win a big tournament.
SD on 13/6/2016 at 13:39
Quote Posted by zacharias
It's pretty obvious what 'technical' means. Ability to control and receive the ball at speed, pass the ball with extreme accuracy, shooting ability and close control dribbling at speed. Ability to bamboozle opponents, do something unexpected or unique.
This nonsense is even funnier when you consider that the two most technical goals scored in this competition - two direct free kicks - have been by Eric Dier, for England, and Gareth Bale, a Welshman who was in the English coaching system from the age of 9.
But the English are technically poor, don't you know, except when they're producing the finest moments of technique in the tournament so far :laff:
Risible, just risible.
Purgator on 13/6/2016 at 17:03
Ireland V Sweden first half over.
Decent shift by the Irish so far, couple of shots could have found the net. They've closed down Sweden pretty well, good work rate.
Second half coming up...here we go!
HOOLAHAN!COME ONNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!
Ireland gone into their shell a little after that goal!
Equaliser for Sweden off Clark's head! AARRGGGHHHH!!!
[video=youtube;uTREvJqFdco]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTREvJqFdco[/video]
Swedish and Irish fans having a laugh(and a few pints)!
Ireland 1 Sweden 1
A pint..err..a point is what Ireland get for their endeavours!
Belgium V Italy later tonight.
SD on 13/6/2016 at 18:55
Ireland would have taken a point before the game, but it's always disappointing to concede like that.
Nevertheless, excellent technique by Hoolahan, who has somehow managed 10 years in English football without the technical ability being coached out of him :)
zacharias on 14/6/2016 at 09:04
Quote Posted by SD
This nonsense is even funnier when you consider that the two most technical goals scored in this competition - two direct free kicks - have been by Eric Dier, for England, and Gareth Bale, a Welshman who was in the English coaching system from the age of 9.
But the English are technically poor, don't you know, except when they're producing the finest moments of technique in the tournament so far :laff:
Risible, just risible.
Payet's goal was better than either of those free kicks.
Anyway, free kicks are not the best indicator of overall ability. It's too specialised and
doesn't even happen in open play. If free kicks were wholly indicative of technical ability then Beckham would be one of the most technical players ever. (Obviously, he wasn't.) You're cherry picking again to suit your argument; just because an english player scored a good free kick doesn't mean much I'm afraid.
The thing that makes you a waste of time to debate with is you just ignore when a bs point you have asserted is comprehensively debunked.
e.g. SD: History has proved that i was right - Gerrard was the most complete midfielder in world football.
Me: Er..actually the last 10 years of football history prove that Xavi and Iniesta were the best and most complete midfielders in that time.
SD: No response.
The same with Pirlo schooling Gerrrad at the last Euros, SD has no response. If Gerrard was the most complete midfielder in world football, why did this occur? Oh right it's not his fault it's because of useless Hodgson. If he was the most complete midfielder in World football, why hasn't he proved that at Euro 04, WC 06, (failing to qualify for) Euro 08, WC 10? It can't all be the coaches fault.
Look at Modric or Iniesta do you honestly think England has a player like this? That is technique. Neither of them could score a free kick very often though, ooh Dier must be better then..
For the record England have had plenty of technical players, but the english national team has historically tended to mistrust them.
SubJeff on 14/6/2016 at 13:56
Come on zacharias, give it a rest.
Tomi on 14/6/2016 at 18:14
Tough luck Purgator, you guys deserved to win that game in my opinion. It won't be easy for you but I hope that you somehow manage to qualify. :D
The worst thing about this tournament so far is that my old anti-favourites have really let me down - I don't dislike them nearly as much as I used to! Of course I wanted Spain and Italy to lose their games, but I didn't lose my sleep even if they (deservedly) won. Czechia (have they officially changed their name already?) just didn't have any chance against the boring but effective Spain, and the massively overrated and overhyped Belgium just don't seem to have whatever it takes to beat the big teams.
Even England seem somewhat likable these days, apart from the idiot hooligans. The same goes for Russia, I suppose, even though their hooligans seem to have become some sort of heroes back in the good old motherland, which is quite disgusting really. Who am I supposed to dislike now?! :mad: Portugal perhaps? We'll see about that later today when they face Iceland. (GO ICELAND!)
In other news, Hungary have just beaten Austria 2-0! \:D/
