**EM in interview : 'It's easy to fall into the trap of trying to please everyone - by bjc_sp
Springheel on 21/4/2013 at 11:24
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When TDM added guards randomly turning their heads & sight-cones, I recall some posts telling players to check it out too, as it undeniably adds a little tension & excitement
Yes, it adds to gameplay when you compare it to the original games ten years earlier, but for EM to promote it as a difficult thing that they "chose" to do in a modern game is just ridiculous. You might as well boast about your "decision" to use lipsynching.
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How does it work, technically, in TDM and in Doom 3?
D3 actually allows you to attach a vision cone directly to the eye bones, which could theoretically move independently of the head (so an AI could look out of the corner of his eye). We kept it attached to the head though, so players could more clearly see what direction the AI is looking. As far as I know this was easy to do even when D3 came out ten years ago. If "most" games are putting the cone in the chest (which I highly doubt), it's out of laziness, not because it's difficult.
SubJeff on 21/4/2013 at 13:48
I think I'd have to have a working knowledge of a whole bunch of common engines before I made that judgement call.
In any case, he didn't say having eye cone fields was difficult, he said that matching them to animations was. Don't forget - as great as TDM is you guys don't have anyone to answer to. If I play and think a few things aren't quite right its not going to affect you at all, is it?
Goldmoon Dawn on 21/4/2013 at 15:44
Quote Posted by Subjective Effect
Don't forget - as great as TDM is you guys don't have anyone to answer to. If I play and think a few things aren't quite right its not going to affect you at all, is it?
Im sorry, but The Dark Mod is closer to Thief: The Dark Project than Deadly Shadow, Thief IV, or *any* other game out there now and probably forever. All one has to do is watch a video about it, like (
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWCaQ1OQ0oc) this one, to see that even without Garrett or *any* official canon it has nailed the core feel of the original two games. Hats off to the Dark Mod team, and I eagerly look forward to the standalone release.
Springheel on 21/4/2013 at 16:12
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In any case, he didn't say having eye cone fields was difficult, he said that matching them to animations was.
What he said was, "Most games' AI only project their line-of-sight cones through the characters' chests, as it's difficult to match up with subtle animations."
At it's base, that means:
Most games' AI do X because Y is difficult.
The claim most games put eye cones in the chest because it's difficult to match subtle animations is ridiculous on at least two levels.
Now he may have MEANT something other than what he said. Maybe he meant difficult on certain engines, although he didn't say anything about engines. Maybe he meant most _old_ games did that, although he didn't say that either. If you want to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he meant something less ridiculous than what he said, that's fine.
But you don't get to assert that "it doesn't say that anywhere", since it clearly does.
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Don't forget - as great as TDM is you guys don't have anyone to answer to.
What does that have to do with what we're discussing?
We didn't implement random head-turning or eye cones attached to the head; that was already part of Doom3 in 2004, which is precisely my point. If generic shooters were doing it ten years ago, it's ridiculous to try and make it sound like an innovation in 2014.
Vivian on 21/4/2013 at 18:53
Are we talking about detection cones anchored to the head, or to the eyes themselves? I could imagine eyes would be a little trickier. And maybe pointless.
zombe on 22/4/2013 at 00:16
Technically it does not make any difference what body part it is bound to. It is also trivial in every even remotely competent engine (as that kind of thing is already built into them for eons already ... vision cone AI component is no different from the other components like "hats" / "weapons" and other accessories).
