SubJeff on 2/8/2013 at 13:36
Well it hasn't reversed my opinion but it has changed it from largely uninformed and optimistic to somewhat informed and doubtful.
I'm still very much on the fence. I'm glad you realise that I'm looking at it logically and objectively, though given the fact that I AM a Thief fan it's not easy. How does one judge one voice as better than another? Or writing as better than other writing? This is all very subjective stuff for the most part (though that writing is actually awful and I'm convinced it's a native language/translation issue).
But given that you know I'm trying to be objective I fail to see the point of sending someone who isn't objective. You don't send someone who hates animals to rate a zoo, do you?
Dia on 2/8/2013 at 14:52
So far, the opinions of the less objective Taffers have struck more chords with me than those who seem to be more objective towards the game. Aspects that the more objective players claim wouldn't impact their gameplay are sometimes the very aspects that do indeed matter to me, such as the absence of S. Russell's voice, no swimmable water, parkour sequences and timed speed runs, to name a few. I would like to know if those very aspects (or lack of them) ended up impacting the less objective player's gameplay (and why) as much as those players feared would happen, or if those aspects (or lack of them) turned out not to be such a big deal to the less objective players afterall. If those aspects didn't matter to you in the first place then I wouldn't feel that I was getting the information I really wanted which is whether they matter at all to someone who deems them to be important. Only someone who shares my concerns could honestly tell me if I should waive those concerns because they didn't matter in the long run. I know you would be painfully honest - especially if there were aspects of T4 that you believed to be totally bogus - but that doesn't mean that your review would answer certain questions which are important to me. Hope that made a semblance of sense.
Specter on 2/8/2013 at 14:58
It would be tough to find anyone who's opinion would matter, and has not already been labelled one way or another by everyone else on the board. Obviously, those who have decided this game is beyond redemption would not make good candidates. I guess the mythological fan would have to be objective, known to the community, plays Thief in a way that pleases most of us here, and able to leave emotion at the door. Even if they hated it, they would have to be very diplomatic about it all, as they are representing all of us. Master Taffer would have been a good candidate had he not also had the apparent stigma of being a mod on the other boards. I'd be happy with a number of people from here, if they could remain balanced in how they view, play, and assess the game.
SubJeff on 2/8/2013 at 15:22
I get you Dia.
Timed runs, parkour, I don't fancy those much. I don't like QTEs either.
Obviously SR would be the best voice actor but for the voice actor to spoil the game for you? I find that a stretch, and an illogical one at that. Sure, it takes away from the atmosphere and diminishes the game but Thief 1 and 2 are great for all sorts of reasons and the main one, for me, is the core gameplay. SR adds to it, but take him away and there is still a great game there.
Or do you think taking SR away actually spoils the whole game?
Swimmable water.
Meh. If there is water we should be able to swim in it. But I don't care about this so much because a. not all missions have or need water and b. it doesn't really alter the core gameplay.
Specter on 2/8/2013 at 15:36
If the game was absolutely perfect in every respect, except for the absence of SR, then it would be tough to walk away from that. Of course, that's fairly hypothetical as the game could never be perfect for anyone in every other respect. Dia has decided that the voice is the crux of her dislike, but its just one of many things. Perhaps it is the one that stings worst for her, which is why she is so vocal about that particular flaw.
EDIT:
It seems Ive passed 200 posts. It only took ten years... Does this mean I can no longer consider myself a lurker?
Renzatic on 3/8/2013 at 01:54
Quote Posted by Specter
It seems Ive passed 200 posts. It only took ten years... Does this mean I can no longer consider myself a lurker?
Yup. You're now officially a slowbie.
Dia on 3/8/2013 at 12:51
The aspects I listed were just a few among many (to which I've objected) that have been revealed by EM so far. What I was trying to convey is that I'd be more interested in reading reviews by Taffers who have the same objections to certain aspects of T4 that I have. If those Taffers played the demo and then posted reviews saying (for example) that the lack of SR's voice, the lack of swimmable water, Focus, parkour sequences, etc., didn't really matter afterall and that they thought T4 was going to be an excellent game in spite of the lack or inclusion of those aspects to which they originally objected, then I'd be more inclined to give T4 a try when it's finally released. If I read reviews by Taffers who share my objections to some of the aspects of T4 such as the following 'for examples' I'd be more inclined to play the game: 'The lack of SR's voice didn't really matter in the long run because I instantly became so immersed in the story that I soon forgot SR wasn't voicing NuGarrett'. Or: 'The parkour sequence actually turned out to be fun and integral to that part of the mission, so my fears regarding having the controls yanked away from me by the devs for this sequence were unfounded - I enjoyed it', or, 'I stopped noticing NuGarrett's zombie hands five minutes into the game and also had no objections to most of the QTEs because I felt they furthered the story/plot of the mission' or, 'Unswimmable water turned out not to be the issue I feared it would as there is very little 'deep' water for NuGarrett to fall into in the game'. I'd be more inclined towards playing T4 if those (hypothetical) reviews were written by someone like Vae, jtr, or Lady Rowena because I know they have the same objections as I to many aspects of T4 so far.
On an aside: when I first heard the NuVoice of NuGarrett I thought the voice to be rather too high-pitched (and still think our very own Sly does a better impersonation of Garrett's voice :p ). There've been instances in some video games and/or movies where the voices of certain actors have grated against my nerves and have definitely affected my enjoyment of said game/movie, albeit mostly in a minor way. So regardless of the fact that SR wasn't brought back to reprise his role of Garrett, NuGarrett's voice didn't appeal to me. But that would still be what I consider a minor consideration compared to all the other aspects of T4 that don't appeal to me so far. In reality, if T4 turns out to be the trainwreck it looks to be so far, I'll be glad SR didn't have a part in it. He probably will be, too. ;)
snowcap21 on 7/8/2013 at 09:52
Quote Posted by Beleg Cúthalion
I won't give you names but a certain moderator of the German Eidos forums has been asked by SE to suggest hardcore Thief fans (himself possibly included) for a special programme during the GamesCom convention later this month. I wanted to give you a chance to start doubting his capabilities as a TruThief fan, lest you be caught by surprise should he say anything positive about the game afterwards.
Don't worry, since there was already a fine example of misunderstanding going on, mistrust can't be far away now. Meanwhile... do you think you could be a bit more specific about what is planned and who's going?
Have fun!
Beleg Cúthalion on 7/8/2013 at 14:05
There's a meeting with the narrative director scheduled at the business visitors' day at GamesCom in Cologne in two weeks (that is, if everything goes well). The community meeting couldn't be arranged in time but will follow later hopefully. For the time being, a friend and I will have the chance to talk to Steven. I'm already preparing my diplomatic vocabulary.
Dia on 7/8/2013 at 14:19
Just wondering how diplomatically you can say, 'You're doing it wrong'.
;)
:ebil:
