E3: Thief Community Interview

Springheel on 5/7/2013 at 11:51

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Wait, what? Why would you need a HUD icon to show that Garrett is crouching?

It can be useful to know whether you're crouched or not. TDM uses the little wings on the side of the lightgem. Using the hands is certainly interesting...I'll have to reserve judgement about it. The floating hands look completely stupid to me and seem to unnecessarily block your view, but Adam appears to be correct--I can't find anyone who has played the game complaining about them.

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or stop to consider what the actual fanbase wants in a new Thief game

This Thief isn't being made for hardcore fans. I don't know how much more clearly they have to say that. It's being made for a mass audience.

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People are going to look at the overall picture - we have two very different opinions. One by a group of mods from the official boards, and one from a well respected PC gaming blog of independent journalists.

It's not just one PC gaming blog, though. That's why it's concerning.

Not only that, but the EM mods actually contradict details that are reported in multiple other places. For example, the EM thread claims, "the light gem operates as a more comprehensive detection meter and fades through various levels of brightness and darkness, like a gradient". Yet, there have been at least half a dozen articles elsewhere claiming that the lightgem is trinary, and has only 3 stages.

So again, that leaves me wondering, why is the EM mod report so different from that of other reviewers?

Chade on 5/7/2013 at 12:35

Quote Posted by Springheel

For example, the EM thread claims, "the light gem operates as a more comprehensive detection meter and fades through various levels of brightness and darkness, like a gradient". Yet, there have been at least half a dozen articles elsewhere claiming that the lightgem is trinary, and has only 3 stages.

You know, I'm pretty sure they've never technically denied the light gem is trinary. When asked about it, they go on about how complex the system is, how it's not binary, and depends on all these different factors, but I don't think I've ever seen anyone actually state the light gem has more then three states. In fact, iirc one of the E3 players gave what I found to be a fairly confusing answer on this topic, saying that the light gem was trinary, but there was definately the potential for it to have more states, and he didn't understand why it didn't (iirc, you understand ... not 100% sure, and haven't double-checked).

I remember finding statements about the light gem to be a bit annoying, because it seemed hard to get anyone to commit to a simple specific answer.

Springheel on 5/7/2013 at 12:40

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You know, I'm pretty sure they've never technically denied the light gem is trinary.

Yes, that's true, but the statement above is certainly going out of its way to give the impression that it's not trinary. And that, combined with the much more negative impressions elsewhere, is what makes me somewhat skeptical of their reports.

MensaLaureate on 5/7/2013 at 12:54

I've read, seen, heard nearly everything that has come out about Thief since E3. Here's my unbiased opinion.

1) Overall, the reviews were scathing. If you don't consider people or media outlets that are affiliated with EM, the reviews and opinions were, overall, brutal. Brutal with a capital B and scathing with a capital S.

2) If you look at reviews or opinions from EM employees or affiliates, the reviews were overly positive. Positive with a capital P. I have yet to see any, and I mean any, critical opinions of Thief from any, and I mean Any (with a capital A) of the mods.

Perhaps they were selected to go because they supported EM and Thief in every facet. Perhaps they were selected to go because they were on the payroll. It should be common knowledge that companies plant employees on forums and message boards to promote (shill) their product. Not sure of the case, here, but it wouldn't surprise me if there are a few plants around here and the official EM site.

Anyways, I applaud EM for taking the bull by the horns and making the game they want. After all, the "hardcore" Thief fans number less than a million people. What a waste it would have been for SE and EM to cater to such a small group. They knew that in order for Thief 4 to financially succeed, they need to grab the Assassin's Creed crowd (which numbers in the multi millions) and win them over. I think they will do that.

Chade on 5/7/2013 at 12:56

Yes. Not sure if you think you're disagreeing with anything I said, but I mostly agree with what you just said (although my skepticism depends on the topic and how clear their answers are on that particular topic ... so obviously, when it comes to statements about the light gem, I am quite skeptical).

But I think we pretty much know that the light gem is trinary. What I'm not sure about is whether the underlying system is trinary, and/or whether any of this is expected to change.

b1skit on 5/7/2013 at 13:29

Quote Posted by Ceamonks890

the way you've been treating actual fans who have even the slightest bit of negative criticism towards your product, ends with them being banned from your own forums.

You can look at the official EM forums right now and see that is simply not true.

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I may rent Thief Reboot at some point

Okie dokie, at least you'll get to play the game :)

Quote Posted by Chade

I don't think I've ever seen anyone actually state the light gem has more then three states. ... not 100% sure, and haven't double-checked.

It feels like a gradient when I play the game, I believe it's more than 3 states - I'll confirm with the team for you. (Please PM me to remind me)

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the much more negative impressions elsewhere

There were also a lot more (http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/Thief-at-E3-2013) positive impressions than negative IMO.

Ok guys, I think this will be my last post in this thread for now. It's gone a little off topic, and being Friday I'm going to try and take as much time away from a screen as I can over the weekend. As promised, I will drop in to TTLG from time to time from now on to be a bit more visible instead of just lurking. Feel free to send me a friend request!

I think I've learned by chatting with you guys that a lot of the issues on these forums with the game stems from misinformation and a lack of fact checking. Please don't assume the worst without at least checking with me or one of the community members who played the game at E3. We're here to help! It pains me to read pages of angry ranting and disappointed hand wringing when the OP has simply misunderstood or reported something untrue. If you ever spot something that doesn't sit right with you, feel free to send me a PM and ask me to weigh in. For an even better chance at a response (unfortunately I am crazy busy), I encourage you to chat with (even just PM) our(http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=138032) E3 community attendees.

Talk to them. They're lovely. These guys have played the game more than ANY BODY ELSE IN THE WORLD right now - Journalists were only given 30 minutes of gameplay time due to the crazy E3 schedule, our community guys were booked for a full hour (Master Taffer/Nate actually managed to get almost a full 90 minutes - ask him why).

They are the biggest experts on what the world has seen of Thief until this point. They will happily answer your questions!

Have a great weekend er'body.

386DX on 5/7/2013 at 15:00

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I think I've learned by chatting with you guys that a lot of the issues on these forums with the game stems from misinformation and a lack of fact checking.

And that my friends is more or less going to go down in history as the official dismissal of fan concerns. EM will now receive this report from their liaison and further negative feedback will no doubt be attributed to rabid Thief fans unwillingness to accept clear information on their boards.

jay pettitt on 5/7/2013 at 15:34

'Tis a little rich when there's so little firm info out there. Heck, letting know whether or not they've got swimmable water* seems to send EM into palpitations, let alone wandering any further from the PR crib sheet. It'll be nice if/when they stop being so entrenched and so, err, desperate to control the messaging. Here's hoping Adam will be back soon and allowed to share some actual new info.

*to be sure, I couldn't care less - I think the quality of the features that are in is more interesting than the quantity of included features if you see what I mean. If there is water, is it awesome. If there isn't - has it been handled less stupidly than in Thief: Deadly Shallows.

Shinrazero on 5/7/2013 at 15:47

Quote Posted by 386DX

When I read his summary, I thought the exact same thing.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

Al_B on 5/7/2013 at 18:16

The lack of definitive information has definitely been a huge problem with the game. I don't think it's wrong to say that misinformation is a problem - it's just that the lack of communication to address concerns has been greater than people misinterpreting facts. It's great that some of those are being clarified - knowing that free roaming isn't as restricted as it initially appeared is very welcome, something that that was only inferred to be limited precisely because the specific details weren't available.