Hunterzyph on 11/10/2003 at 05:50
Pros and Cons department here folks. I've already watched Operation Flashpoint II get delayed till 2005 because of the Xbox and I know the PC version of Deus Ex II was delayed so it could be released simultaneously on the Xbox....so I'm wondering if in trying to make the game work for both a PC environment and the Xbox that certain features were either left out or toned down.
Pros:
1. More people will get the opportunity to play DX2 without worrying about investing$400 in a upgrading their system. Thus a far larger audience.
2. More money for Ion Storm...more money -> more talented staff -> more flexibility -> more independence (ie Non-sequel).
Cons:
1. Mod support probably non-existant. Not important for the Xbox, not important for the PC.
2. DX9 features (if possible with the engine) cut out as not usable on the Xbox.
3. Probably a shorter game as effort to make was split between two versions, rather than focusing on one.
4. Quite possibly not optimized for the PC. Ten times as much effort will be put into polishing it up for the console than the PC version. Why? Because they can patch. So on 12/2/03 when it ships, even with the fastest rig out there, the Xbox version will most likely beat it hands down.
Loké on 11/10/2003 at 07:34
PC version sshould take priority, and then they port the end result to the xbox, cutting stuff when needed.
Oh yea: Consoles+FPS=crappy controls. Always.
Thirith on 11/10/2003 at 11:24
That point about the non-modability is somewhat silly... look at Morrowind. Developed for both Xbox and PCs, and check out how many MODs there are for it.
NoOne on 11/10/2003 at 15:43
more people is good. whether they actually are into games like deus ex is another question. no informatsion about modding part yet, is there? i certainly hope there is a modding possibility, sdks or something cause this is what makes a game lately.
i'm concerned about ui and controls though. those will surely take a big hit due to console controller setup. ui already looks weird enough on screenshots, i surely hope they don't simplify the pc version's controls like they have to simplify the console ones :(
dx8/9 differences are pretty much shaders only you know. and that's not hard to implement some (maybe additional) dx9 shaders for pc version. that's a design decision and it probably won't affect final look that much. dx9 thing is simply too overblown atm.
and i certainly don't agree on that shorter game part. engines have to be quite different, i admit that, but content stays the same. maybe it's even good for pc version because it should have less content flaws/bugs. for the same console non-patchability reasons.
-Londiste
...i'll never grow up!
ACT SMILEY on 11/10/2003 at 22:23
I don't feel that OFP2 has been delayed that much by OFP:xbox. Yes, due to small company size it will have a bit, but aren't you forgetting the mass slippages BIS made with the first one to get everything just right? Or didn't you read the Flashpoint 1985 previews which gave a 1999 release date?
Con 1 looks to be wrong, from what I've read about DX2 so far. And the reasoning behind 3 is a bit off, as its more likely to be shorter to up the detail than anything else.
If DX2 slips, its going to be because the team probably know that if they don't deliver, rabid fans will bite their balls off so its in their interests to make it perfect rather than release early.
bob on 17/10/2003 at 00:46
Well Ive been reading through the Thief 3 forum and found some stuff about both Thief and Deus Ex and porting to XBox. Warren Spector said that the content, gameplay, etc will be the same. Only difference is that they will have to break up maps for XBox and lower the res. And prolly a couple other aesthetic changes. If anything, the game will be worse on XBox than on PC.
Dont worry, your beloved Deus Ex sequel wont be crap just b/c they are making it for XBox too. It may be crap, but b/c Ion Storm did a bad job not because of the XBox constraints.
BizRodian on 18/10/2003 at 04:21
The UI is the big thing for me. I trust the team enough not to dumb it down, but when I look at screen shots for this game, it makes me cry. I worry about the size of levels, sure Spector might now be saying that on the PC they will be bigger, but he wasn't not too long ago.
You just have to look at Deus Ex on the PS2. Back then the PS2 was a modern gaming system, and the game lost a LOT...
I don't agree with the quality thing. On a PC, to make money, you have to either make a junk Tycoon game or really really really work hard, and even then, you have a good chance of not making it (look at LGS.) Consoles are much easier in my experience. Get a few good reviews, and all the people owning the console will sweep it up. Who cares about the PC fans now?
I'm sure I'll enjoy the game, but everytime I see it now, I feel as if it's not a PC game, it's an X-Box game. It's just another series we've lost.
Celwyn on 14/11/2003 at 04:23
I think maybe people are thinking about this the wrong way. There is no "we" and "they" for PC gamers versus console gamers now... those lines have blurred a long time ago. Many a gamer uses both.
More importantly, the Xbox is not really a console like the PS2 anyway. Think of it as a PC dedicated to gaming only. You can get a keyboard for the thing. A little bit of hacking and you can make it run Linux.
I remember playing "Crusaders of Might & Magic" on PC and then playing the Playstation version... I felt like I had been degraded to kiddie-land. The PS2 games may not be much of an improvement, but that is probably more the fault of the developers than the technology. I play Thief and System Shock 2 on my PC but Morrowind on my Xbox because my PC is not even close to powerful enough to run it. The technology is there. The Xbox definately has it, and while it's possible that one might have to accept graphics that are inferior to the PC version, rest assured developers will make it possible to see those graphics for those who have the technology.
The capabilities of the Xbox mean there's no need to dumb down the game itself, and many former PC gamers have purchased that particular console because they have gotten tired of buying a game and having it not work for mysterious, inscrutable reasons not easily attributed to the need for new drivers or whatnot. Morrowind is a fine example of a game that did not get dumbed-down, and I think we can rest assured the developers of DX2 and T3 are following the same philosophy.
As for the UI, the tendency in user-interface design is to have _less_ elements cluttering up the interface, as this interrupts the immersiveness. DX2 would probably be like that even if consoles were not involved. Also, Morrowind for Xbox proved that a simple controller can still be used for quite involved menu navigation when the menus are designed correctly.
Besides, PC gamers sometimes map their controls to a controller/joystick anyway... I know I've done it, to save my wrists.
I understand the fear, based on my experience with inferior console games and versions, but in this case there's little if anything to worry about. Hopefully nothing will happen to prove me wrong!
Morte on 14/11/2003 at 19:28
Quote:
Originally posted by BizRodian The UI is the big thing for me. I trust the team enough not to dumb it down, but when I look at screen shots for this game, it makes me cry.
Being developed simultaniously for the Xbox has probably helped the interface a lot more than it has hindered it. A streamlined interface is a good thing, and a controller doesn't have a gazillion buttons to make up for laziness.
BizRodian on 26/11/2003 at 02:39
Quote:
More importantly, the Xbox is not really a console like the PS2 anyway. Think of it as a PC dedicated to gaming only. You can get a keyboard for the thing. A little bit of hacking and you can make it run Linux.
I already have a computer that can play games and run Linux.
Quote:
I think maybe people are thinking about this the wrong way. There is no "we" and "they" for PC gamers versus console gamers now... those lines have blurred a long time ago. Many a gamer uses both.
Maybe for you the lines have blured, but I've played plenty of console games as well and they're most often dumbed down and ugly. I don't think it's coincidence that almost every game I have been looking forward to on PC that happens to be released on a console at the same time has been very dumbed down and not enjoyable.
Quote:
Being developed simultaniously for the Xbox has probably helped the interface a lot more than it has hindered it. A streamlined interface is a good thing, and a controller doesn't have a gazillion buttons to make up for laziness.
How is having lots of controls being lazy? unless you only like to cycle through everything.
