GMDX Dev on 17/12/2015 at 11:38
Yes, but faetal has been the one on the attack the most and when I called him a douchebag it was in response to that, otherwise I have done no such thing.
Anyhow, I enjoyed talking with you all despite our differences and traits. I may pop in from time to time to talk some more, and I will be more receptive next time around. This is just a subject that means far too much to me, as sad as that may seem.
PigLick on 17/12/2015 at 12:02
I find it hard to see where faetal has been on the attack, just calling you out on bullshit arguments. Anyway, at least we have this huge thread now eh?
faetal on 17/12/2015 at 12:48
Anything which gets Dethy out of retirement has to be a good thing.
faetal on 17/12/2015 at 12:51
Quote Posted by GMDX Dev
this is a subject I've put far too much time into discussing, analyzing and even being upset by over the years to be told it's all fine and dandy.
"I don't like recent game so no one else should either."
Next time, try presenting your opinions as your opinions and the facts as facts and avoid conflating the two. Works wonders for getting your point across.
heywood on 17/12/2015 at 13:02
When we're discussing tastes in gaming, one person's bullshit is another person's truth. Here at TTLG we have some posters with very narrow tastes in video games and some with very broad tastes in video games. That is a good thing for the most part, although when topics like this come up the discussion can get polarized. I'm actually surprised this thread stayed on topic for as long as it did.
Nobody likes it when game-specific threads get shit on by posters who only want to say "this game sucks" over and over in various ways. But that's not what's happening here. This is a thread specifically about 90s gaming, and I saw a lot of people getting defensive about the thread's premise right from the start.
Quote Posted by Jason Moyer]I stand by my assertion that, regardless of whether or not the best games ever made came out in the 90's, the golden age by any reasonable definition would have been the arcade boom, second console generation, and widespread availability of 8-bit computers that all roughly coincided with each other in the late 70's and early 80's. Not to forget the primitive handheld games that became popular at that time pre-Gameboy. You've got the massive popularity of arcades (and the ubiquitousness of arcade games from bars to grocery stores to restaurants), the Atari 2600, the Colecovision, the Commodore 64, the Atari 800, the Apple
[, and portable LCD games. Videogames were massively commercially successful for the first time and the first generation of hardcore gamers was being made (not just with videogames, but the sudden popularity of tabletop roleplaying).
I would say that the early 80s saw the rise of video games, but "golden age" normally refers to the peak of a civilization and the time when its greatest works were accomplished.
PigLick on 17/12/2015 at 13:12
I wouldnt say this thread is specifically about 90's games, its more of a comparison between what was and what now is.
bangersnmash on 17/12/2015 at 13:33
I changed my mind, The greatest game of all time is Pac Man.
Manwe on 17/12/2015 at 14:05
Quote Posted by GMDX Dev
So you'd prefer if Dishonored had auto takedowns? Dishonored worked the same way as Tenchu for takedowns and it is a much more satisfying way. Pressing a few buttons to perform highly complex actions is mindless enough as it is, we don't need any dumbing down of this sort.
Like I said I actually agree with you about FP games. That is because the mouse + keyboard combo allows for a very high precision of movement without requiring much skill on the part of the player. And nothing better has been invented since then (except maybe the Valve controller?). That is not the case of tank controls on a D-pad, which is an obsolete control scheme designed for an obsolete piece of tech that was supplanted by the dual stick gamepad (and works as an ersatz of mouse + keyboard).
Also you're conveniently ignoring the amount of streamlining Dishonored benefited from. You don't have to actually land on your enemy for the kill animation to play, or even press the attack button at a very precise moment. Sometimes you'll completely miss your target, and the animation will play anyway. The game is very generous in that regard. Just like you don't have to aim with your melee weapon to hit someone's head from behind like in Thief. You just press the attack button and watch a cutscene play out. This bit of streamlining was pulled straight out of Tenchu, which was the first game to have automated takedowns and a killcam. If anything, Tenchu is directly responsible for the shitty takedowns in DX:HR.
Quote:
Dishonored shares a lot in common with classic Tenchu gameplay-wise, actually, so saying that type of gameplay has no place today is already proven false.
The simple fact that one is a FP game playable with a mouse & keyboard and the other is a third person game with precision jumping, immediately sets them apart in my mind. Tenchu is more akin to the early wave of 3D platformers (think Croc on the PS1).
Anyway just to be clear, I know I have been harping on about Tenchu, but I don't actually hate the thing. I recognize its importance in the evolution of the stealth genre (particularly third person). But it was just one step of that evolution. Splinter Cell Blacklist/MGS5 is the peak of that genre.
Also I fired it up to see if it still holds well, and you were right, it mostly does. Graphics/animations are great. Overall presentation is top quality. And the soundtrack does sound good. Even the controls are not as bad as Duke Nukem Time to Kill. That being said, it's still a pain in the ass to play and I just can't be bother with tank controls in this day and age.
GMDX Dev on 17/12/2015 at 15:39
Quote Posted by faetal
"I don't like recent game so no one else should either."
That's how you choose to interpret it.
Quote:
Next time, try presenting your opinions as your opinions and the facts as facts and avoid conflating the two. Works wonders for getting your point across.
Pretty sure I did, but never mind.
Nameless Voice on 17/12/2015 at 15:51
I'm going to summarise my opinion on this whole argument.
* Most big-budget games these days are somewhat dumbed down to appeal to the most possible players (even if they don't appeal as much to players who like to think.)
* Not all games suffer from this, but it's still prevalent, and even the smarter AAA games have made some concessions.
* Modern AAA games still have things in them that can be appreciated if you keep an open mind.
* The rise of indie gaming in recent years now means that more of every kind of game is being made, including ones that focus more on specific niches (such as players who like to think), as opposed to the AAA games that try to appeal to everyone.
These are actually very similar to the points that GMDX is talking about, but I've phrased them in a less hostile manner.
