Renegen on 26/7/2006 at 15:45
To make a link between anti-depressants and this thread, as people say they merely act on you as long as you take them and are only temporary solutions. Taking the drug doesn't really make you happy. Something that Sypha is doing here too is that he's blocking the emotions and trying to manage it all, which is also only a temporary solution. The more you try to sink everything in the back of your brain, the more time the psychiatrist will have to pry these emotions out of your brain for you to talk about. You can't deal with the emotions by supressing them, this is why you have this built in anger, it's from past events/experiences. You're living a positive life to an extent, that's good, but you also need to deal with your past, and really that's why other people can help, because they know the proper way to eliminating these emotions.
OrbWeaver on 26/7/2006 at 15:58
Quote Posted by Agent Monkeysee
I was under the impression you can't "cure" depression anyway, just like you can't cure schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, or OCD. We're not good enough at the brain science to do that. You develop means to cope with it.
It depends what you mean by "cure" I suppose. It is possible to make a complete recovery from depression such that you need no further medication or visits to a therapist in order to live a happy life. This does not, of course, guarantee that you will never suffer from it in the future, in the same way that recovering from a common cold does not give you any future immunity.
Quote Posted by Renegen
You can't deal with the emotions by supressing them, this is why you have this built in anger, it's from past events/experiences.
It's not just past experiences (although they can have a significant effect), but present beliefs which lead to a series of irrational conclusions that in turn lead to depression. For example, from the observation "I hate my job" you conclude "I will never spend time doing what I like", and from the observation "I dislike living with my parents" you conclude "I will never have any privacy or freedom". That is what cognitive therapy tries to address.
TheGreatGodPan on 26/7/2006 at 17:46
I'm always eager to plug Dalrymple's writings and (
http://www.city-journal.org/html/14_4_oh_to_be.html) here's one suitable for the subject:
Quote Posted by Theodore Dalrymple
There is something to be said here about the word "depression," which has almost entirely eliminated the word and even the concept of unhappiness from modern life. Of the thousands of patients I have seen, only two or three have ever claimed to be unhappy: all the rest have said that they were depressed. This semantic shift is deeply significant, for it implies that dissatisfaction with life is itself pathological, a medical condition, which it is the responsibility of the doctor to alleviate by medical means. Everyone has a right to health; depression is unhealthy; therefore everyone has a right to be happy (the opposite of being depressed). This idea in turn implies that one's state of mind, or one's mood, is or should be independent of the way that one lives one's life, a belief that must deprive human existence of all meaning, radically disconnecting reward from conduct.
A ridiculous pas de deux between doctor and patient ensues: the patient pretends to be ill, and the doctor pretends to cure him. In the process, the patient is willfully blinded to the conduct that inevitably causes his misery in the first place. I have therefore come to see that one of the most important tasks of the doctor today is the disavowal of his own power and responsibility. The patient's notion that he is ill stands in the way of his understanding of the situation, without which moral change cannot take place. The doctor who pretends to treat is an obstacle to this change, blinding rather than enlightening.
Rug Burn Junky on 26/7/2006 at 18:15
This has been another installment of:[INDENT]"TGGP quotes extensively from two bit conservative hack rather than forming and expressing his own opinion."[/INDENT] Thank you for watching, and we now return you to your regularly scheduled broadcast day.
OrbWeaver on 26/7/2006 at 18:24
Dalrymple is not referring to what the psychological profession terms "depression", he is referring to the attention-seeking behaviour exemplified by taking an overdose of painkiller and calling up your friend 20 minutes later and asking for help.
This is still a psychological issue, but it is not the same as depression.
Oh, and he needs to expand his vocabulary a little. Using the word "evil" in every sentence makes one sound like an idiot.
ilweran on 27/7/2006 at 10:30
Quote Posted by Ghostly Apparition
She tried Prozac, I wouldn't recommend that drug for my dog. Its terrible.
I'm not advocating for drug companies. But I see what a difference it makes in my wife, and no she doesn't sit on the bed all day like a zombie either. LOL
Its not a happy drug, meaning it doesn't make you happy all the time, but it does enable her to function, go to work and lead a normal life. On the other hand when she doesn't have it is when she wants to spend all day in bed sleeping. (iiritable etc)
I was a zombie when on anti-depressants, but mine were prescribed by a GP and I believe she put me on too high a dose- I eventually reduced the dose myself without telling my GP and everything was reasonably ok after that. When I started heading that way again, and it was very obvious what was causing the depression, I felt it was better to change the situation rather than change me.
Right now I'm happier than I've ever been, I have a job I love, a fiance I love and we're hoping to be able to move out of my parents house next year, I'm going to learn to drive and to play the guitar and once I've passed my driving test I'm going to look into doing a photography course. I also doing a lot of training in work as well which is helping me in this job and will look good on my CV. I don't know what will happen in the future, but I really appreciate the happiness I have.
And I hated prozac, only took it for three days, it was 8 months before I felt 'normal' again.
JACKofTrades on 27/7/2006 at 10:47
Recently, I was chatting with my brother at work via email where he was lamenting the fact that he hates his job and was trying to pin down exactly why this was so. I think he made a rather interesting observation:
"If you’re creative enough to visualize ideality, and if you’re observant enough to detect almost every nuance of reality, then the discrepancies between the two are a constant assault on your mental wellness. I think that intelligence actually contributes to depression. A heightened awareness of the differences between actual and ideal is, to a certain degree, maddening."
Ko0K on 28/7/2006 at 05:30
Quote Posted by JACKofTrades
Recently, I was chatting with my brother at work via email where he was lamenting the fact that he hates his job and was trying to pin down exactly why this was so. I think he made a rather interesting observation:
"If you’re creative enough to visualize ideality, and if you’re observant enough to detect almost every nuance of reality, then the discrepancies between the two are a constant assault on your mental wellness. I think that intelligence actually contributes to depression. A heightened awareness of the differences between actual and ideal is, to a certain degree, maddening."
That is an interesting perspective. Intelligence is a relative matter, but I have noticed that depressed people do have a gap between their ideal life and reality.
Aja on 28/7/2006 at 06:25
The solution is: Get Another Degree! :D
Para?noid on 28/7/2006 at 07:35
Quote Posted by JACKofTrades
"If you're creative enough to visualize ideality, and if you're observant enough to detect almost every nuance of reality, then the discrepancies between the two are a constant assault on your mental wellness. I think that intelligence actually contributes to depression. A heightened awareness of the differences between actual and ideal is, to a certain degree, maddening."
I couldn't agree any stronger, that is so true. But one wishes to fight this in order to overcome the burden, yes? So the answer is simply that one must apply oneself to whatever pursuit is required to fill this gap.
Conversely, we have someone like Sypha who thinks that all his problems and roadblocks have a distinct and completely insurrmountable solution (if truly he is willing to accept a solution). The harsh lesson he must learn is that half his problems are a result of his own pathetic inaction, his own fear of taking hold of the reins and steering the horse down the path he wants to follow. When people pile up in their droves to tell him "Oh god, it's the medication" and "oh god it's so hard to find work in those parts" it merely augments his defeatist streak and supports his base desire to stop trying and let mother take care.
And I admit that it's a trait we all share- after all, why not put the blame on external circumstances like "medication" or "residences are so expensive around here". Eventually, losers satisfy themselves with a chain of events that lead back to the inital problem and in doing so, it allows them to slip into a chain of events that are ETERNALLY BEYOND THEIR CONTROL, giving them the oppourtunity to throw up the hands and say "Well, it's NOT MY FAULT, MOTHER WILL CARE FOR ME.... UNTIL SHE DIES????".
Sypha, you have the personal capacity and resources (from family and friends) to really make something of your life, as do all the privelidged individuals who visit this forum. It becomes extremely tiresome to watch you throw out laundry list after laundry list of self-diagnosed bullshit and half-dreams: "I want to be a writer one day."
You want to be a writer "one day"? Why don't you want to be a writer now? Why do you hold off, waiting for some kind of teenage valhalla where your creative juices run free and buxom maids pander to your every whim as you tap into the deep well of profound creativity?
People can crap on and on offering the same bullshit solutions about medication and "maybe you should see someone"; but let's face it - the only thing you need to come face to face with is your own childishly staggering ineptitude towards change and embrace the lifetime you have been offered. Jesus god man, just do it. Move on. Stop being an attention-seeking sadsack.
