*Zaccheus* on 2/3/2010 at 15:04
My understanding was that Germany simply wanted to ensure that all kids get a high quality standard education.
Bluegrime on 2/3/2010 at 15:39
Quote:
I wish people would enter their location in their user profile. So we can see what country they live in, and where they are coming from.
Why? If you disagree with something a person says, your counter argument shouldn't have anything to do with their nationality.
CCCToad on 2/3/2010 at 16:09
Quote Posted by *Zaccheus*
My understanding was that Germany simply wanted to ensure that all kids get a high quality standard education.
Part true, they argue that its necessary for that and what I said earlier, preventing the development of "parallel societies". Its easily construed to mean those who think differently from the established way of thinking.
*Zaccheus* on 2/3/2010 at 23:08
Quote Posted by Bluegrime
Why? If you disagree with something a person says, your counter argument shouldn't have anything to do with their nationality.
It sometimes helps to understand the assumptions which they might make.
Bluegrime on 3/3/2010 at 00:06
Quote Posted by *Zaccheus*
It sometimes helps to understand the assumptions which they might make.
No, it helps YOU draw assumptions about what they know or do not know. Which has nothing to do with disproving something with facts. How could it possibly help you refute something someone says to know what country they are from? The only way that would work is if you accept the "Your from... So your wrong. Period." school of thought.
Gryzemuis on 3/3/2010 at 00:28
Quote Posted by dethtoll
I don't think you get to make generalizations about the United States, particularly since the Netherlands' primary export to TTLG is uninformed insanity.
I think I get to make more generalizations about the US than the average american (including you) is allowed to make about the Netherlands or Germany.
Considering the facts that 1) I've spent 1.5 years of my life in the US, 2) I can read English, including English websites, newspapers, TV programs, etc, 3) you and most Americans can't read Dutch, 4) nor do they speak German, 5) I happen to speak German, 6) for the last few decades, we can watch German tv stations (including German news) in the Netherlands, 7) I happen to live 200 meters from the German border. :)
On the Internet, everybody makes generalizations. I just think it's harder for Americans to make them about Europe, because your sources of information are really much more limited than vice versa. If not only because our politicians and our mediapeople love to stick their noses in American buttholes.
Gryzemuis on 3/3/2010 at 00:34
Quote Posted by Bluegrime
How could it possibly help you refute something someone says to know what country they are from?
Knowing where someone is from would help me decide whether I need to explain more, what to explain, how I can use comparisons to explain my case, etc. The biggest source of discussion is the fact that people often miscommunicate. Even when they agree, it can take while until they figure out they agree. Knowing the other guy's background can help tremendously. Discussion is not only about the differences between opinion. It's also about how to reach agreement.
Example: suppose we discuss communism. Do you really think there is no difference when the other guy is a 20 year old kid from Texas, or a 60 year old Russian ?
Gryzemuis on 3/3/2010 at 00:47
Quote Posted by CCCToad
Yes, it is true that starting your own school is possible, but not really practical for someone with a full time job.
You're not supposed to be a teacher. The way you do it is: you find a few parents who have the same ideas as yourself. You rent a classroom, you hire a teacher, you put 5-10 kids in the classroom, and voila, you have a new school. Of course, this works for the schools for kids age 4-12. Not for the schools for 12-18 year olds, but that can be done too. If you do it right, the government will pay the biggest part of the budget (or all of it even).
This is written in our constitution.
Yes, it's crazy. In the constitution it is called "Freedom of education". Basically it means you can start any school you want, and the government pays for it. This was put in the constitution at the beginning of the 20th century. Our confessional parties wanted the government to pay for their Catholic and Protestant schools. Wasn't gonna fly. But other parties wanted to give women voting rights. The confessional parties blocked that. In the end, there was a deal where women would get voting rights, only if the "Freedom of education" was put in our constitution.
Yes, you have the right to call the Dutch stupid. In many ways we are.
Bluegrime on 3/3/2010 at 01:16
Quote Posted by LittleFlower
Example: suppose we discuss communism. Do you really think there is no difference when the other guy is a 20 year old kid from Texas, or a 60 year old Russian ?
What does that have to do with them checking off a nationality on TTLG? Of course theres a difference, but it has absolutely nothing to do with what they claim as home country on the internet. The only reason you would need to know what country someone hails from is if you intend to treat their statement differently depending on what country they hail from.
Thirith on 3/3/2010 at 07:07
Quote Posted by Bluegrime
No, it helps YOU draw assumptions about what they know or do not know. Which has nothing to do with disproving something with facts. How could it possibly help you refute something someone says to know what country they are from? The only way that would work is if you accept the "Your from... So your wrong. Period." school of thought.
I'm not sure whether you're being disingenuous, stubborn or just stupid. A number of people have already said that knowing where someone's from can help you understand where they're coming from, what assumptions they're likely to make etc. Cross-cultural miscommunication is a very real thing, and you don't need to be from two completely remote cultures for it to happen. A lot of unspoken assumptions are linked to where someone's from or where they live, and having an idea about these unspoken assumptions can in turn help preventing or mitigating crossed wires.
If someone then uses "You're from X, therefore your opinion on Y must be wrong", then you can beat them down. Until then, though, you just come across as a git.
