Could "T2X: Shadows of the Metal Age" be better than TG and T2? - by Sanctus Germanus
derfy on 7/10/2016 at 17:06
T1 gave me my first SHAS so there's that. :(
Also, if they could mod the T2 engine to allow bunny hopping, I would be *so* happy.
Luthien on 7/10/2016 at 20:17
Quote Posted by User 205
T1 seems to be the most popular here on TTLG but outside T2 seems more well liked.
Okay, let's see.
T1: 6 votes
T2: 17 votes
T1 = T2: 5 votes
several posts are unclear
* Two or three of the T2 votes are by people who quite obviously don't know T1 at all.
* Two or three state they like T2 more than T1 because the controls in T1 were so awful. What the bloody hell are these people talking about? The controls are almost the same in both games with only very slight differences.
* About five of the voters in favour of T2 think that TDS is a better game than T1, making me doubt whether they actually understood and played all three games.
* Many of these people seem to have played these games through only once, because someone who actually likes the games and knows them well wouldn't make posts with "T2 > TDS > T1" or "+1" as their whole contents but would give at least some hint why she thinks so.
Overall, while there seems to be a preference towards T2 in that place, opinions are somewhat biased by some people not knowing what they actually talk about.
T1: 6 votes
T2: 3 votes
T1 = T2: 3 votes
undecided: 1 vote
A very boring retro-blah-blah-review without a real conclusion.
Another boring retro-review, but he actually says that "TG is arguably the best of the bunch" (5:30).
=>
Two of the four links you provided support the opposite of what you claim they do, and one makes no statement at all.
--
Sorry, that is what happens when you make a statistically doubtful claim without checking validity of your data to convince mathematicians of your opinion. At least I believe you that you did not specifically pick sources that support your opinion.
Starker on 7/10/2016 at 20:38
Quote Posted by User 205
T1 seems to be the most popular here on TTLG but outside T2 seems more well liked.
Yup: (
http://www.strawpoll.me/3655532/r)
There are a ton of players who consider T2 to be the best game in the series, Ben Croshaw included.
Luthien on 7/10/2016 at 22:14
:D
You know, to me this question is more of professional interest, not whether the final colour comes out blue or pink (I couldn't care less). If them folks continue coming up with tiny data sets from non thief-dedicated games download sites with questionable data, claiming that the old, much bigger data sets produced by proven and mostly well informed Thief fans count less that opinions stated by casual nowadays one time gamers, they're going to have a hard time convincing anybody of their data (not Starker of course as he'll stay on the ignore list and can claim whatever he wants without me even noticing). And yes, I demand the same relative quality of my own data; I just don't go about and make claims without proper data.
thief-outside-a-box on 7/10/2016 at 23:25
Quote Posted by Luthien
I'm just trying to replay T2X, and I really wonder how one could even think about it being better than either of the original games' missions. Although it is amazing fan work, and the missions *are* a pleasure to play,
it is buggy to the point of where you have to restart missions, linear, with tight but empty levels, lacking real difficulty settings, the authors keeping control over every action you do. There's none of the freedom of the original missions.
This I never encountered (the trainstation aside, where I was forced to switch from "loving everyone" to "blackjacking everyone"). What missions did you have to restart?
The difficulty setting is true, I've replayed the whole campaign from "normal" to "expert", hoping that the ... smugglers would turn into blood-freezing-death-exhailing-despair-inducing gods as I encounter them again, alas to no avail.
bjack on 8/10/2016 at 00:08
theif-outside-a-box, thanks for the tips on T1/TG FMs. I have played some of those already, but missed many. For T2, I've played nearly everything, including many of the total crap contest entries.
For T2X, I don't find it that buggy, but the last time I selectively played a few of its missions, I used the enhanced version and with a fully patched New Dark T2 install. I have a faint recollection that it was a bit buggy the very first time I played it. As for difficulty levels, well if compared to FMs that have different content at each level, then T2X is not as good. If compared to T2, then it is about the same to me. A few more guards, less health, and higher loot requirements - with maybe an extra task to do.
I can say that I do not have any interest in playing it front to back anytime soon. Maybe in 2 or 3 years. I did try it a few months ago and wound up skipping to the brothel. ;)
Starker on 8/10/2016 at 05:15
Quote Posted by Luthien
And yes, I demand the same relative quality of my own data; I just don't go about and make claims without proper data.
Uh-uh. A couple of relatively close polls on one forum and a few posts from years ago counts as proper data... who knew. But of course for Luthien other polls won't be proper polls if they aren't being answered by the proper fans on the proper forums.
The claim was for all players, though, not just people on TTLG, so in essence the leap is from "there are more people on TTLG who prefer T1 than there are people who prefer T2" to "most players think T2 is inferior".
User 205 on 8/10/2016 at 08:30
You only seem to pick out stuff that supports your opinion (instead of taking a look at the whole thing) Also you seem to have some kind of elitism against fans who are not as "hardcore" as you, which is bloody disgusting :eww:
Thief 1 was mostly critisised by the press and a lot of players for having too big emphasis on undead and fantasy levels where stealth was kinda sabotaged (I personally still liked a lot of those levels but stuff like "Escape!" and "Strange bedfellows" dragged the whole game a little bit down) Then when Thief 2 came out it was praised for being a superior stealth game.
Regarding the gggmanlives video "T1 is arguably the best of the bunch" was referring to it being the scarier out of the two (not in the terms of quality like you assumed)
Edit: I´m sorry for getting a little bit hot-headed but that happens :p
marbleman on 8/10/2016 at 09:14
In my personal experience T2X is the least buggy game out of TG, T2 and T2X.
T2 is by far the buggiest, even with newest Tafferpatcher, there are still infuriating things happening (people getting stuck on stairs in Angelwatch, guards getting alerted for no reason in Precious Cargo, a couple of other minor bugs).
In TG (with TFix installed) guards also often get stuck. I had to restart Cragscleft more than once, because a hammer in a factory got stuck facing the only exit out of prison and never moved again. Made sneaking past him with Basso impossible (which for me is a reason enough to restart, since I mainly play Ghost).
T2X is by far the least buggy one (if you install T2XFix), but it's not without problems too. But then again, it's only my experience.
Quote:
Also you seem to have some kind of elitism against fans who are not as "hardcore" as you, which is bloody disgusting
Elitism, yes. Although Luthien's in his posts seems more or less reasonable in his own way, GMD's posts about trenches are downright elitist. Being on this forum and participating in discussions longer does not mean you're superior to people who came here later. Nor does it mean that your opinion is always correct a should be taken "as is".
Honestly, I don't care which game is considered superior. But backing up your claims with "Oh, we've been on this forum for so long and sucked out every drop of TDP, while you weren't here" is just disgusting.
