thief-outside-a-box on 8/10/2016 at 09:55

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Going by what I remember from the reviews I read back then T2 got a bit panned for not providing anything new/atmosphere. Also, it is 92 to 87 in metacritic based on 18 critic reviews each for TDP. The user score is equal, yet TDP fields about 100 reviews more.
(http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/thief-the-dark-project/critic-reviews)
(http://www.metacritic.com/game/pc/thief-ii-the-metal-age/critic-reviews)

Then again, this is a small batch of critic reviews. Plus reading a few, it shows while trying to compare them all around is rather futile, unless someone seriously wants to in-depth-analyse every single one.
Two examples regarding T2:

Eurogamer 90
But with more interesting and varied missions, bigger and more detailed levels, new enemies (and allies), a few new toys to play with, and some vital tinkering under the bonnet, Thief II stands on its own merit.
- what? In one of the links above someone provided a rundown of variation through their respective first 7 levels. Plus T2 rehashes the same map in DIRECT sucession, as well as a TDP map.

Gamer's Pulse 80
It has provided me with in excess of 60 hours of pure addictive gameplay, and has earned a permanent spot on my shelf, sharing space with the likes of "Kings Quest 1" and "Doom."
- unless the reviewer deems Doom/KQ1 mediocre, then why, oh why, did T2 only score 80?

Luthien on 8/10/2016 at 12:35

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Taffer, I've read through the *whole* bloody boring, garbage threads you provided links to, from the first line to the last, in other words, I've spent more time reading and watching your "proof" that yourself. You're talking rubbish, and I hope you know it and are just trolling.


Okay, so you people run to mommy, crying your eyes out, because people are "elitist" (Ttlg has always been a place for elitists). And then you go round and call people or their behaviour:




Vomit in their face:



Insult them (yes, the term 'nerds' is an insult):




Laugh in their face:


Judge other people's opinions with scatology:

(Sorry, had to remove you from the list for quoting)

And then complain that people don't take you three seriously. Maybe this has something to do with the above behaviour. You may think that this kind of behaviour is acceptable, but while you may have gotten away with it in school, in real life it's not.


I am sorry, but you still do not begin to understand what "being in the trenches" really means. It's not your fault; you haven't been there at that awesome time and missed the amazing stuff that happened an the overwhelming amount of information about all aspects of the game. Only the collective research of several generations of taffers on Ttlg made things like the speedruns, climbing to almost every spot in every mission or Azal's "Strange & Unsusual" guide possible in the first place. So, anybody from that time is not just the stupid old fart you want to see in them. While everybody has their own opinions, all us old time taffers are well informed in most aspects of the games. No new player can gather this much information on her own from scratch because life is too short for that, and there were hundreds on Ttlg. The oldtimers have earned respect in the Ttlg community by contributing funny, amazing, entertaining or otherwise interesting things, not by just claiming "what I think is at least as valuable as what everybody else thinks". You don't even have to respect us to earn our respect - just contribute something valuable. Failing that, you'll have a hard time erasing the image of thin-skinned "generation Y" kids that you very much display at the moment (you personally maybe a bit less than the other two).

I'll also give you a hint why you have aggravated Goldmoon Dawn so much and made him say things like "you obviously don't know who luthien is": In the early 2000s I've been the craziest, most dedicated second generation taffer there was. I've spent more time playing and discussing TDP/TG/TMA than you can imagine. Only a few other people know as much about how the game and its engine work as me. Walking into this situation calling me "clueless" is simply arrogant, not just towards me (which I don't care about), but everybody who was part of the good ol' times.

marbleman on 8/10/2016 at 12:55

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Luthien, I do understand what you're saying.

That's true, I've learned a lot about Thief from other people, but I've also learned a lot by myself, and as of now, I understand the game quite profoundly. Yes, I haven't played it as much as you, but I am formulating my opinios based on hundreds of hours of playing and hundreds of hours of reading this forum (for a couple of yers before I finally signed up).
Moreover, it is my belief, that even if somebody picks up a game today and expresses their opinion based on immediate awe - it doesn't make their claim any less viable than anyone else's. After all, it is all a matter of personal preference, even if something is objectively better. That's been my point for the entirety of this discussion (although I sometimes might formulate it in an agressive manner, for that I apologize).

On a side nore - what's the problem with the train station? I've never encountered game-breaking bugs there.

Luthien on 8/10/2016 at 13:22

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That's right, but you don't get any credits for such a sentence here. At Ttlg you need to be able to back your opinions with arguments to be taken seriously.


Accepted. :)


Several times I lost all in-game sound (except ambient sound) and had to restart the game (but not the mission). In the mean time this has also happened in another T2X mission. What forced me to restart was that I was sneaking up on a guard, making a quicksave when he turned around noticing me, failing the "don't let the smugglers see you" goal. The other restart was because I did not get that you have to go to the "lounge sitting room" in the rear car and close the door there, not just to the room I'd call sitting room and close the door of the car. Very confusing, but maybe not a bug. I remember that I had the same problem on my first time through.

marbleman on 8/10/2016 at 13:33

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Interesting, I've lost all game sound in TG a couple of times, I guess one time in T2 and never in T2X. I guess, it's a dark engine thing.


Well, is a reason in a comment from a newcommer like "I like this game, because it feels better, because I enjoy it more" not good enough? Not everybody goes into mathematical and statistical analysis, some people rely on emotion more :)