242 on 25/10/2007 at 16:34
Quote Posted by BR796164
I'd say it's Shooter 1.5.
2.0 was the original concept before they realized it would be a too big cookie for them to bake. :(
For me 2.0 means open-ended maps, a simulator/sandbox, RPG elements, inventory, consequently - good replayability value.
Chuck on 25/10/2007 at 19:37
I don't know. I found it kind of cool at first, but it seems all you do is shoot at shit. Where's the rpg elements? Equiping artifacts? It's also very foreign and may alieanate a player. A guy at work gave it up minutes into the game because everyone talks in Russian. It's certainly not a friendly game.
Though it does look pretty.
D'Arcy on 25/10/2007 at 23:21
The game takes place in Ukraine. What's so wrong about people speaking ukrainian or russian between them? To me it just adds to the atmosphere. They do speak english with Marked One, so I don't see what could possibly be the problem.
Chuck on 26/10/2007 at 01:12
I agree with your post; it's just an observation made by a co-worker and I could see that it clearly affected his enjoyment. Overall the game does have a very foreign feel to it. This guy is a total Halo fanatic, but I convinced him years ago to try Operation Flashpoint, and he loved it. I don't think Stalker does enough to keep one interested. I've got a save where I'm escorting a scientist out of a lab and through a tunnel. Every damn time I try to get back into the game, either the scientist runs past me into the ambush of what, like 5 guys waiting on the outside, or I run past him and die in a hail of crossfire. I think about starting over, but it's really nothing more than a long series of firefights.
But it sure looks pretty.
I guess I'm dissapointed because I realy want to like this game.
steo on 26/10/2007 at 01:39
I think perhaps the hardest thing to like about this game is the fact that it is too damn realistic. You can't take a dozen bullets, you can't get spotted inside a high security base, hide for thirty seconds and then be fine, you can't walk up behind someone, reload your gun and pull out your knife without him noticing.
What you can do is get spotted, run and hide and then take a guy by surprise and then blow his face off... But expect his mates to be looking for you.
Rogue Keeper on 26/10/2007 at 07:34
Quote Posted by D'Arcy
The game takes place in Ukraine. What's so wrong about people speaking ukrainian or russian between them?
That's cool and different! But I'd like to have subtitles for the Ukrainian chatter that's going on around me out of the dialogue window. Also the English could have been gramatically polished. Is it so difficult to hire a pro translator/language corrector? They are going out to the international market with it afterall.
Quote Posted by steo
I think perhaps the hardest thing to like about this game is the fact that it is too damn realistic. You can't take a dozen bullets...
The realism of firearms damage has been argued a lot. The inefficiency of basic weapons like MP5 (generally recognized as the most efficient submachine gun ever) or AK variations with 7.62 cartridge (why aren't AK74 and AN94 chambered for 5.56 like in reality?) is ridiculous. In fact 7.62 caliber has slightly better stopping power than 5.56 at the cost of higher recoil. AK74 in the game has correct high recoil and miserable accuracy at higher distances, but it isn't compensated with it's decent stopping power if it incorrectly uses 7.62 cartridge. You can take few bullets and die, but not the opponents, they can stand more than you. It always seems to me as if the opponent's fire was more accurate than mine. And I can waste two 30-round magazines on a zombie in moderate distance before it falls down - mere stopping power of high velocity bullets would smash them back, but they walk like untouched.
This may vary with difficulty level, but if the difficulty would be arguably realistic on Stalker level, damage model is less realistic on higher difficulties, to your disadvantage.
Also there are too many kinds of weapons in the Zone in the first place, too many NATO rifles and pistols.
242 on 26/10/2007 at 10:18
Quote Posted by Chuck
Where's the rpg elements?
Quests, optional quests.
Inventory.
Active interaction with NPCs.
Ability to sell and buy.
NPCs life simulation.
Day-night cicle.
Global map (it just separated into sections for performance reason) - NPCs can migrate to other sections of the map.
Quote:
It's certainly not a friendly game.
Here you're right. Like Thief or SS2, they're not friendly :) Doom3 is friendly however. "friendly" and "deep" are almost always exceptive abstracts when it comes to games.
Rogue Keeper on 26/10/2007 at 11:16
Active interaction with NPCs is more like an adventure element.
The miniquests are rather simple and stereotypical. Clean up a camp, kill a person, sometimes find an item.
Similarly there isn't any exclusive corellation between day-night cycle + life simulation and RPG genre.
242, did you watch the development of Stalker since like 2002? The original promises were like gold, it sounded like they are going to redefine the hybrid FPS/RPG genre before BioShock attempted to. But they have reached the limits of their skills or whatever. The life simulation experienced the bigger cutdown. What's left of true RPG character development in final Stalker is rather funny. Far behind character development in Deus Ex and Shock 2.
Sad! But like someone said, even if it looks more like action shooter, still it's better than 80 percent of shooters out there.
242 on 26/10/2007 at 12:45
Quote Posted by BR796164
242, did you watch the development of Stalker since like 2002?
No, I didn't watch its development and wasn't interested in this game at all until some feedback and reviews forced me to try it. Now I can't help but find it considerably more immersing than Bioshock and even System Shock2... Probably bacause I love sandboxes and two latter games aren't exactly sims, however Thief is :) For the same reason I like Hitman much more than Splinter Cell.
steo on 26/10/2007 at 20:42
Quote Posted by BR796164
The realism of firearms damage has been argued a lot. The inefficiency of basic weapons like MP5 (generally recognized as the most efficient submachine gun ever) or AK variations with 7.62 cartridge (why aren't AK74 and AN94 chambered for 5.56 like in reality?) is ridiculous. In fact 7.62 caliber has slightly better stopping power than 5.56 at the cost of higher recoil. AK74 in the game has correct high recoil and miserable accuracy at higher distances, but it isn't compensated with it's decent stopping power if it incorrectly uses 7.62 cartridge. You can take few bullets and die, but not the opponents, they can stand more than you. It always seems to me as if the opponent's fire was more accurate than mine. And I can waste two 30-round magazines on a zombie in moderate distance before it falls down - mere stopping power of high velocity bullets would smash them back, but they walk like untouched.
The AK74 and AN94 are both, correctly, 5.45x39mm in stalker. The NATO 5.56x45mm rifles should, in basic terms, be more powerful and have greater recoil than the 5.45x39mm rifles. The AKS-74U has a barrel roughly half as long as the other assault rifles in the game, so is understandably pretty useless at range. The AK74 is older and cheaper than the other rifles, which is the only explanation for its shoddiness in game. IIRC, the AN94 Abakan wasn't nearly as bad as the other 5.45mm rifles but it's been a while since I played an unmodded version of stalker.
As for the inefficiency of the MP5, I agree that they overdid it but it isn't without realism - it's the only SMG in the game and the only automatic weapon not to use a rifle bullet. As such it has extremely low recoil compared to the rifles but also much less stopping power. A basic kevlar vest is designed stop the relatively low velocity rounds of pistols and SMGs but stopping a rifle round requires much more heavy duty armour. Given the extremely dangerous nature of the zone, pretty much everything has adapted to have either solid skin or some kind of armour, which limits the use of pistol bullets. Had they included a P90 in the game then it might have been different, since the FN 5.7mm pistol round is designed for penetration and the gun sports a fast rate of fire, 50 round magazine and is extremely compact.
On the toughness of enemies I agree with you, even basic bandits seem to be able to take a hell of a lot more bullets than you can unless you hit them in the head and, yeah, there's not really any reason why a zombie should be able to take bullets any better than anyone else - his bones are still going to break, even if he can't feel the pain - so this must be a decision of gameplay over realism: zombies would be a piece of piss to kill if they died easy.
