demagogue on 22/4/2009 at 03:26
I'm a big fan of public schooling.
I think it helps people get the idea that being a good citizen doesn't mean being ludicrously patriotic or idealist, but the more modest (and practical) realization that we all live together in this community, saints and assholes alike, and have a shared stake in making it a decent place.
It's not just that they are socializing, but socializing in a setting where they are always expected to be "part" of something shared (yeah, "an equal basis" is part of that, but also a "shared" basis I think) ... and constantly being reminded that they and their values aren't the only one's in this community. And feeling uncomfortable about that isn't good enough to ignore it and think "I don't need to deal with those other people/values in sticky, day-to-day realworld situations." It's exactly being constantly put in that uncomfortable compromising situation that makes it so valuable IMO.
That is so much more enlightening than all the stuff I've heard about this case. That's a pet-peeve of mine when people shelve their critical-thinking anytime a situation gets political or emotional.
Scots Taffer on 22/4/2009 at 04:33
Quote Posted by demagogue
I'm a big fan of public schooling.
shit you know I came into this reply and read that as shooting
ilweran on 22/4/2009 at 09:26
Quote Posted by demagogue
I'm a big fan of public schooling.
I think it helps people get the idea that being a good citizen doesn't mean being ludicrously patriotic or idealist, but the more modest (and practical) realization that we all live together in this community, saints and assholes alike, and have a shared stake in making it a decent place.
How often does that actually happen though? What I learnt from school is that if you stand out in any way - listen to different music, dress differently, have an actual interest in learning, want to have an intelligent conversation - your peers will hate you and make your life hell.
By the time I got thrown out of 6th form (combination of ill health and the wrong postcode :rolleyes:) I hated my peers and didn't want anything to do with them - an attitude that probably didn't help to improve my popularity, but it was a bit late by then anyway.
Kolya on 22/4/2009 at 09:46
Yeah, they hate you if you're clever and they despise a fool. But you'll have to deal with idiots for the rest of your life, so you might as well get used to it. By the time you get out of school you may have developed a set of sharp weapons that include wit, faces and knowing when it's best to run like hell.
For the record: I hated most of my schoolfellows too. But I also found a few select friends.
rachel on 22/4/2009 at 10:14
Quote Posted by Kolya
By the time you get out of school you may have developed a set of sharp weapons that include wit, faces and knowing when it's best to run like hell.
Alternatively you may end up mentally crippled, unable to trust anyone completely, even friends, analyzing everyone's words as somehow implying something against you, generally having your self-esteem shot to hell, and other nasties.
Kolya on 22/4/2009 at 10:28
You're a mental cripple, asshole!
ilweran on 22/4/2009 at 10:41
Quote Posted by Kolya
Yeah, they hate you if you're clever and they despise a fool. But you'll have to deal with idiots for the rest of your life, so you might as well get used to it. By the time you get out of school you may have developed a set of sharp weapons that include wit, faces and knowing when it's best to run like hell.
I have never in the workplace - or anywhere else, but I tend not to go out on a Friday or Saturday night - had to dodge chairs being thrown at me, had food rubbed in my hair, been punched, kicked, tripped up, had knives thrown at me or been pushed out into the road in front of a car.
Scots Taffer on 22/4/2009 at 10:51
Quote Posted by Kolya
You're a mental cripple, asshole!
Just so you know, I genuinely laughed at this. Good to have you back.
Koki on 22/4/2009 at 11:45
Quote Posted by raph
Alternatively you may end up mentally crippled, unable to trust anyone completely, even friends, analyzing everyone's words as somehow implying something against you, generally having your self-esteem shot to hell, and other nasties.
collateral damage.
Melan on 22/4/2009 at 13:48
Quote Posted by Kolya
Yeah, they hate you if you're clever and they despise a fool. But you'll have to deal with idiots for the rest of your life, so you might as well get used to it. By the time you get out of school you may have developed a set of sharp weapons that include wit, faces and knowing when it's best to run like hell.
Hard to say. In HS, I had to routinely cope with stuff that would be real honest to goodness criminal behaviour in the real world, and make me file a report with the police pretty much immediately. Harrassment and abuse are just harrassment and abuse, not a valuable life experience, and I didn't even experience the worst...
My brother who is five years my younger had a much less unpleasant school experience (coincidentally, he went to a school where students were under much stricter teacher supervision than the comparatively more "liberal" place I attended), and he became much better at RL relations than I am. Granted, I got a lot better later on, but I had to put a lot of work into things he takes for granted - overcoming the insecurities and lack of trust I built up, socialising, etc. etc.
I'd say my time in university was more representative of how real life is: there is a lot of hard work before you, but you are accomplishing things, working on subjects that interest you, and if you really don't like something, you have the opportunity to just get up and walk out. That last possibility, in particular, makes you a master of your own life, and not a prisoner of others. It feels great.
[edit]Wow, look at the thread tags![/edit]
