Fragony on 9/2/2010 at 09:14
Sadly can't but would if I could. London used to be one of my favorite towns, sometimes it still is but never very long :(
mrle01 on 9/2/2010 at 09:35
You think that's strange? Let me tell you about a case that happened here in my country (thats Croatia).
This local business man sexsualy assaulted an American basketball player, who played for local club, by sticking his finger in her anus. So eventually it came to the court and the judge found him not guilty and said that sticking a finger into anus isn't a sexual assault but a form of greeting between people, like a handshake.
Eventually he was fired from being a judge (5 years after this case), but it wasn't because of this decision (he had a couple more equally strange decisions) but for some other reasons.
Of course, sonn under Wikipedia's article for "handshake" it was written that "in Croatia sticking a finger into someone's anus is considered handshaking". It was deleted later.
SD on 9/2/2010 at 10:24
Quote Posted by Fragony
There are hundreds of sharia-courts in the UK, they supposedly only do heritage and marriage stuff but there is a lot of human suffering under the surface. If a muslim girl has a problem with it, what's she gonna say, 'no I will just take regular court'? Have a nice honor killing. The UK is letting it happen because of the suffocating social control that is political correctness.
As usual, you are talking guff. Nobody has less time for religion than me, but tolerance of sharia courts that sometimes overstep their civil remit has absolutely nothing to do with "political correctness" and everything to do with pragmatism.
Yes, in a better world, people, particularly women, in these patriarchal cultures would feel free to use our neutral, secular courts, but more often than not it's a choice between sharia justice and no justice. These people won't use an ordinary court.
Now, if you have any ideas for solving the problem of integration that don't involve expelling or ostracising the minority in question, I'm sure we'd be happy to hear them. Until then, courts that hand down orders to attend anger management classes to abusive husbands (for instance) are going to be the lesser evil.
DDL on 9/2/2010 at 10:36
Plus Frag seems to think that "have a nice honour killing" is the end result, no questions asked, off you go sir.
And while there HAVE been honour killings in the UK, they have been followed by..murder convictions, because OMG it turns out "honour killing" is against the law in the UK. Who woulda thunk it?
And it's worth noting that there have also been quite a few 'regular killings' in the UK as well, which also resulted in murder convictions.
The problem there is not the government refusing to "smash the culture out of those crazy muslems" or whatever Fragony might like: the problem is people killing other people, which is pretty universal.
Fragony on 9/2/2010 at 10:44
@SD I have no idea, wherever we are heading there isn't a way back we will just have to make the most out of it. But as long as the concerns of natives are made to feel like less important, which isn't that odd a sentiment, any chance of a good outcome is digging it's own grave. I am a bit irritated that people who never wanted to see a problem are now asking us right-wingers what our solution is, we don't have one, this discussion is 30 years too late.
Plus Frag seems to think that "have a nice honour killing" is the end result, no questions asked, off you go sir.
Don't underestimate the pressure that is a possibility. What would you recommend a muslim girl who meets a guy, falls in love, and wants to marry him against the will of her family. If you say the only right thing: 'you go girl', and she complies, then you have just gotten her in a lot of trouble.
DDL on 9/2/2010 at 12:06
ITT: Fragony realises societies are not static
EDIT: If you want to take a topical example, then yes, and she might die (recent example of this, she did). And then the people who killed her will go to jail (recent example of this, they did). And then eventually they'll figure out that killing people for honour doesn't fucking fly in this country, and yay!
The solution is not to stamp out "everything a bit islamic" in case it leads to honour killings, it has to be more gradual than that. Remember, the vast (VAST, FFS) majority of muslims in the UK think honour killings are just as stupid and abhorrent as you do. Moderation is the norm, not the exception.
Fragony on 9/2/2010 at 12:41
Quote Posted by DDL
The solution is not to stamp out "everything a bit islamic" in case it leads to honour killings, it has to be more gradual than that.
I don't go for that, I don't really care about integration it isn't reasonable to ask that from them, they can keep what they have as long as they don't park it in my garden. But when things don't go as those who thought this was to be the greatest thing ever thought it would go the problems aren't handled, the messenger is blamed so they can keep living in their fantasy-world of everybody getting along just fine. This multicultural ideal must die, just leave us be and I think we will be fine. No problems where I live, but there are in the bigger city's, nowhere as bad as in other country's but the thing is that nothing is being done about it, it is a minor problem, but when it accumulates it isn't small for the people who are on the receiving end. One egg in your face is something different then getting one every day, but it's still just an egg in the face to our representatives.
Remember, the vast (VAST, FFS) majority of muslims in the UK think honour killings are just as stupid and abhorrent as you do. Maybe you should talk to them instead of about them, you will be amazed. We have a lot of muslim students here, all very liberal, well educated naturally, but when you scratch the surface when it comes to family and family-honour you aren't going to find anything pleasant.
Stitch on 9/2/2010 at 16:24
Is anyone besides me disappointed to see Fragony return to his old pet hate as opposed to spinning off into new territory? The whole anti-global warming bit revealed that he was capable of being ignorant and crazy on more than just one topic, and I was kind of hoping he'd next take up a crusade against the relationship between the moon and the earth's tides, or perhaps even plastic-wrapped comestibles in general.
Instead our Fragony is in reruns.
Fragony on 9/2/2010 at 16:42
A request for social exclusion, we we us, typical, it's a party next door.
You lefties know we have a certain outlook when it comes to come here and bring your whole retarded village. We have been saying it for years and were, well well. And now the same people are saying we don't have a solution. Some nerve. What we do have is damage control.
Stitch on 9/2/2010 at 17:03
An assault against coherence in general, I approve!
