Jenesis on 1/2/2004 at 13:15
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Originally posted by theBlackman In MY opinion, every religion has some validity. They all are aimmed at reaching the same goal. They just have chosen different routes to get there.
To get from where you are, to where you want to go, in life, as in reaching a "holy sanctuary" there are many differing roads one can travel.
tBm - this is a view I've heard before, but one which, I believe, does not stand up to scrutiny. Consider, for example, one of the difference between Christianity and Islam; Christians, as I imagine everyone in this thread is aware, believe that Jesus was crucified, buried, and then resurrected, and later taken up into heaven. The Koran, however, teaches that someone else was killed in his place, and that Jesus was taken straight up into heaven without dying.
Now, these are not differences of theology or opinion, but disagreements over historical fact; they can't both be right. If Christianity is correct, and part of the Koran is shown to be wrong, then the Islamic claim that the Koran is the Word of God dictated to Mohammed and accurately recorded is shown to be false (unless you believe that Allah lied), and so the basic foundation of Islam is lost.
On the other hand, if the Koran is correct, and Jesus wasn't crucified, then the basis of Christianity is proved to be incorrect, and so it is shown to be gibberish.
So, if one of these two religions is leading to God, or heaven, or however you want to put it, then the other cannot possibly be doing so.
Now, what you might say at this point is that crucifxion aside, Jesus told his followers to live well, and that that might be where the 'validity' of Christianity lies. But if this is the case, where do you get this idea from?
jay pettitt on 1/2/2004 at 13:28
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Originally posted by Jenesis So, if one of these two religions is leading to God, or heaven, or however you want to put it, then the other cannot possibly be doing so.
only if god is really that petty.
SD on 1/2/2004 at 14:26
Quoth Jenesis:
Consider, for example, one of the difference between Christianity and Islam; Christians, as I imagine everyone in this thread is aware, believe that Jesus was crucified, buried, and then resurrected, and later taken up into heaven. The Koran, however, teaches that someone else was killed in his place, and that Jesus was taken straight up into heaven without dying.
Don't want to complicate matters too much here, but there are certain "Christian" bodies who do not believe in the crucifixion; most famously, perhaps, the Knights Templar, who are rumoured to have ritually defiled the symbl of the cross.
If Christianity is correct, and part of the Koran is shown to be wrong, then... the basic foundation of Islam is lost.
On the other hand, if the Koran is correct, and Jesus wasn't crucified, then the basis of Christianity is proved to be incorrect, and so it is shown to be gibberish.
And on the third hand, if neither is correct, we have proven that religion is hogwash, bunkum and gobbledegook ;)
StD
SD on 1/2/2004 at 14:34
Originally posted by jay pettitt
only if god is really that petty.
he/she/it is that petty
for instance, he hates fags...
StD
Morte on 1/2/2004 at 14:46
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Don't want to complicate matters too much here, but there are certain "Christian" bodies who do not believe in the crucifixion; most famously, perhaps, the Knights Templar, who are rumoured to have ritually defiled the symbl of the cross.
That was just a bunch of bollocks the French king made up so he could disband the order and grab their (considerable) wealth.
Eshaktaar on 1/2/2004 at 15:03
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Originally posted by Strontium Dog he/she/it
is that petty
Don't forget jealousy; don't you
dare have any other god beside Him!
TF on 1/2/2004 at 15:20
As a non-fanatical Christian, I feel uncomfortable.
Jenesis on 1/2/2004 at 15:43
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Originally posted by Strontium Dog Don't want to complicate matters too much here, but there are certain "Christian" bodies who do not believe in the crucifixion; most famously, perhaps, the Knights Templar, who are rumoured to have ritually defiled the symbl of the cross.
Can't say I've heard that about the Knights Templar, but I would not consider any group, which calls itself Christian but does not believe in the crucifixion, to be a Christian group. Sure, they can call themselves Christians, but this does not make them followers of the Christian faith as it is defined in the Bible (even if the Bible doesn't use the word 'Christian'). Even most non-Christians who have read the Bible would agree that the crucifixion is central to the Christian faith. Indeed, if they don't believe in the crucifixion, why would these people want to call themselves Christians?
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And on the third hand, if neither is correct, we have proven that religion is hogwash, bunkum and gobbledegook ;)
This is, indeed, the third logical option, given the above, at least as far as Christianity and Islam go. The main point I was trying to get across, though, was that they can't
both be true.
*Zaccheus* on 1/2/2004 at 16:12
The crucifixion is absolutly central to christianity. It's our ticket to heaven.
No crucifixion = no forgiveness of sins.
My answer to the "all roads lead to Rome" argument is that I'm actually trying to get to Jerusalem.
:joke:
John D. on 1/2/2004 at 17:09
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My answer to the "all roads lead to Rome" argument is that I'm actually trying to get to Jerusalem.
:laff: :thumb:
