Koki on 13/8/2011 at 06:31

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Redundant is good. Remove redundant and you end up with IW.



I know next to nothing about Morro/Oblivion systems but I will bet you ten bucks there is a mod which completely fixes both games without removing anything and it was made in less than two days.

TheUnbeholden on 14/11/2011 at 04:28

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I'm wondering what everyone thinks about the attributes being removed now that the game is out?

Personally I think they should have kept the attributes, because it helped distinguish your character. Whats the difference between a Warrior and a Wizard? Is it just what hes skilled at? Of course not. A Warrior is also stronger and tougher than a Wizard. Does a Wizard who trains with a sword in his spare time who's equal in skill with the warrior with it, going to be as strong as him? Of course not, a Warrior also trains with hand to hand, axe's, blunt weapons ect...
With no athletics, acrobatics or speed attribute than how do you make your character faster or jump higher or fall greater lengths?
I like the fact that they merged Mercantile into Speechcraft... but why remove Mysticism?
As for melee weapons, they should go back to the way they where before, 6 separate skills made the most sense.


If they wanted to improve the system, IMO what they should have done is kept the attributes. But also did what they did now and removed the Major skills and Minor skills concept, so that all skills contribute to leveling (and the skills that are higher contribute more to leveling thus encouraging you to focus on a play style). Heres the new part, they should make it so that each skill contributes to 2 governing attributes. The first attribute is the one affected the most,

So
Armorer - Endurance/Strength
Long swords - Strength/Endurance
Blunt weapons - Strength/Endurance

ect. So that there are more ways to increase your endurance among other things. It makes sense though that fighting for long periods of time with a sword will increase endurance slightly, but strength mostly.

Schwaa2 on 14/11/2011 at 18:15

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I like it fine.

The new skills tree is pretty in depth so you can still fine tune a character in many ways.

I've been working certain trees more than others (two handed first 'perk' : 20% more damage) then after that you have a split where you can go in different directions. But you base skill has to be high enough to get better 'perks'.

So in a way it's much like the old system.

You have to use two handed to level it up. Then as it gets better you have more choices how to use it.

In speech you don't have personality. But you gets splits for charming opposite sex, haggling, whatever.

Phatose on 15/11/2011 at 19:45

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I certainly don't miss the Morrowind/Oblivion stat system. They were largely redundant - if you compare vs Fallout or DnD, stats served the role of an unchanging baseline. With Elder Scrolls though, they increased the same way skills did, and since you increased them by leveling up skills, removing them was perfectly reasonable.

Losing speed/athletics does kind of suck, but that really should've been dealt with in the perk system. Create a perk tree unattached to any particular skilll that contains general abilities like increasing walk speed or carrying capacity. Give the modders a couple of weeks, and I'm sure that will be created.

I like this system a lot better.

That said, I can already see where it's going to break down. I'm level 30, and the skill cap on skills I use is approaching rapidly. I don't have anywhere near enough perks to max those skills though - and once they cap, in order to gain more perks I'll need to increase the skills I don't use.

Practical upshot is that to be a better swordsman, I'll need to use magic or pickpocket.

Plus, there is the massive gap between perk effectiveness. I'm wishing I could get those perks I spent on Alchemy back - it's obvious I'll need to sink way too many perks there to make it better then store bought potions.