demagogue on 20/5/2020 at 01:46
An old schoolmate asked his FB feed if anyone actually knew anybody that's even had coronavirus, and he literally got 50+ affirmative responses within a few hours, and then his logic was, well out of his whole friends list everybody probably knows 10,000 people, so 60/10,000 is still negligible. But my intuition says if you post something like that and get 50+ responses just off the cuff, that's not something one should so easily dismiss. And I know some people didn't reply because I didn't; no way I want to walk into a thread like that.
Anyway, it doesn't matter what people's anecdotal observations are. Just look at the statistics, and recognize the statistics will get better over time as they get more information about the disease's profile. (The idea there is the stats we have now are imperfect, but still a better guide for policy than nothing, and we can expect in a year or so the statistics will be much better. But what we have now is still sufficient to make some judgments.) And people that think hospitals and state officials would just take bunk statistics to "make money" or to "embarrass Orange Man Bad" (as if he needs the help), I'm not sure you're going to be able to talk sense to them anyway.
Pyrian on 20/5/2020 at 01:48
Quote Posted by Tocky
Thinking and facts bad. Following conservative herd good.
If enough of them develop anti-truths, they get herd immunity to logic.
Renzatic on 20/5/2020 at 02:05
It's difficult to argue with people who think everything is a conspiracy, because any slight discrepancy or weird bit of policy can be used as an excuse to "not believe the narrative."
Though for those who take it too far, you end up getting this interesting mix contradictory talking points that have been jammed together just because everyone's been passed around on social media some point.
As far as I can tell, the coronavirus outbreak is a hoax perpetrated by the democrats to shut down the economy, harming Trump for the 2020 election, but Trump did a spectacular job foiling their plans it by shutting down all foreign travel, and recommending hydroxychloroquine as a miracle cure, which the Democrats and their meat puppets in the MSM have been shitting on because they're rather you die from the hoax disease than doesn't exist rather than admit that Trump was right all along. Also, he never said it was a hoax, and the hoax virus was created in a lab in Wuhan WHICH OBAMA TOTALLY FUNDED, and the whole thing was orchestrated by the Chinese to hurt Trump in 2020.
...so what's true here? ALL OF IT! Don't believe what they tell you. Do your own research. Think for yourself! OPEN YOUR EYES!
They'd rather believe that the Democrats, the media, the WHO, the CDC, the NIH, all our various hospitals, all our various medical research facilities, Bill Gates, and Anthony Faucci, and maybe even the goddamn freemasons are all working in tandem to do one thing: hurt the American people, and take down Donald J. Trump, rather than entertain idea that Trump kinda fucked things up a bit, and made things worse by not owning up to it, and correcting course. The simple explanation is a little TOO simple, right? If can't be explained with a flow chart, then it's probably some radical leftist narrative yadda yadda yadda SOCIALISM! COMMON CORE MATH!
How the fuck do you reason with people like that?
Renzatic on 20/5/2020 at 02:08
Though with that said, China does deserve some flak for the outbreak. It's kinda obvious they've fudged their numbers, and tried to keep a lid on things for as long as possible to save face, and it cost the rest of the world some valuable time. The WHO trying to placate China in the meanwhile certainly didn't help things.
Though they don't get ALL the blame, because a goodly number of other nations still managed to fuck things up, long after China gave up trying to contain it, and it became obvious what we were all dealing with.
Nicker on 20/5/2020 at 02:23
Quote:
single payers systems are over run with 1000's dead.
Citation please. And a little specificity would help.
In the mean time, correlation does not imply causation. Please join the dots between single payer medical insurance and infection rates for Covid19.
Quote:
under 300k dead GLOBALLY. the fear and numbers did not materialize.
More like 320k dead. There would be a lot more but many countries took swift, national action to contain the spread. It worked.
Tocky on 20/5/2020 at 02:35
I know. They are all over facebook with how it's not as bad as they predicted and SEE? SEE? the experts were all wrong! Millions of corpses are not lying in the street! Then you point out that things were done to mitigate and BAM did mitigate just like we wanted and it's like they can't add two plus two and see it themselves. That's how it was supposed to work. They also forget the worst part of the Spanish flu was after the first wave. But hey, damn liberal demoncrat hoax yada yada ad infinitum.
Nicker on 20/5/2020 at 02:50
Sadly, the USA may stand in as a model for how things might have gone if they were not managed as well in other countries.
To bulk up these astroturf "Hang Fauci and Open My State" rallies, rich Republican organisers have been shipping in "locals" from hundreds of miles away, even across state lines. Many of those people have been returning to areas with low infection rates. This is based on cell-phone data.
Stupid states will reinfect smart states. By November all the financial and personal sacrifices of the winter and spring will be wiped out and it will all begin again, only worse.
Renzatic on 20/5/2020 at 03:43
If we have to go through this a second time, it's gonna be an absolute nightmare. A bunch of weekend warriors with their tacticooled up AR-15's, screaming about fighting tyranny and oppression, bum rushing governors with guns brandished all across the country, blocking hospital routes with their cars, and throwing the greatest temper tantrum the world has ever seen. If they end up disrupting things to the point we get a dose of the worst case scenario, they'll just do what they always do, and blame someone else.
I'm tired of making excuses for these dumb shits. This is so far removed from the usual liberal vs. conservative divide it's not even worthwhile entertaining it as such. They're a bunch of weak minded dumbshits who have bought hook, line, and sinker into a long con perpetrated by a goddamn real estate agent from New York who's treating the presidency as his personal vanity project, and they've deluded themselves to the point that they actually think they're fighting a 2nd revolution against a bunch of Cold War communists who have infiltrated the country from within. When you get right down it, all it really is is just a bitch fit for the sake of having a bitch fit, a way to fleetingly feel like those badasses who don't take shit, and don't give a crap they watch on TV. Hey, look at me, I'm wearing a punisher skull t-shirt. I talk about having an "angry side" you "don't want to meet" on the internet! Here's a picture of my fucking gun, and a vaguely veiled threat about shooting census workers! I'm a Real American!
No. They're bored assholes, citizens all of the richest nation in the world, who are so spoiled, they believe temporary inconvenience is utter oppression. They're 4 year olds who grew up with a mommy and daddy who never told them no.
You want to fight real tyranny, fuckwits? Go to Hong Hong, where merely questioning the government can earn you a public beating, and a quick trip to a reeducation camp. Here, an armed mob can storm a capital building, and you don't even get a slap on the wrist for it. How can you say you're oppressed when you can do that, and you have an entire political party blowing you for your votes?
People need to call them out for the children that they are.
demagogue on 20/5/2020 at 04:23
I read one article saying the optimal strategy is 4 months lockdown 1 month open in a cycle for at least the next 18 months, and I had that kind of expectation. If we thought this round was bad, the next 2 or 3 rounds of this will be off the rails.
The other thing that I appreciate from personal experience that I think a lot of people, the dismissive crowd, are discounting is that this thing, when it does go south for someone, doesn't give them much or any forewarning. The first time I even suspected I had this, the entire room was spinning, my chest was on fire, and I apparently had already had full on pneumonia without even feeling it build up. It wasn't like I felt a little sore throat or muscles or a little cough that built up over the next few days. It was zero to 60 in an instant. And I've been reading articles where by the time people started having symptoms they'd already passed a point of no return.
That's one part of this thing that makes it particularly awful. You're having a normal day, you're in your 30s or 40s and perfectly healthy, and the next thing you're on your deathbed and have to start making final arrangements with your family without even the chance to see them. I can look back and feel okay since it subsided, but in those first few days I didn't have any indication if it would or not and had to act assuming it might not. If people appreciated how awful that is, I think they'd respect some of these restrictions designed to keep them from the possibility of facing that kind of thing.
Renzatic on 20/5/2020 at 04:25
For some people, it isn't real until it happens to them.
