Starker on 1/6/2020 at 11:40
Yet, these examples were precisely the ones where you said the police actions were entirely justified.
demagogue on 1/6/2020 at 11:42
You guys are going to go in circles forever because there's both types of people involved in the protests.
What you should be focusing on is proper police behavior, and the answer to that is science-based deescalation training, which police going over the line even to address legitimate criminal activity evidentially have not been trained in. There's no debate they have a duty to prevent violence and looting, but the methods they use to do it is in question.
And there's also a principle in US constitutional law, civil and political rights in all liberal democracies really, that says when you have large scale protests, especially if they are spontaneous, the police need to allow the legitimate exercise of the right to assembly to the extent possible, and only have the most minimal restrictions necessary (the LRA or least restrictive alternative) to address imminent violence and destruction of property, in any case, restrictions that allow the protests to still go on unfettered for those peacefully engaging in it.
Starker on 1/6/2020 at 11:51
To be sure, I don't condone violence of any kind, not even property damage. But what I've seen from the US police these last few days has just been extraordinarily excessive. I'm not buying even for a moment that the police is going soft on the protesters and that harsher measures are therefore needed. But, unfortunately, it seems escalating this is fully in Lord Dampnut's interest and he's going the full "Law and Order!" route of Nixon.
catbarf on 1/6/2020 at 15:33
I think you can recognize that strong measures are needed to subdue violent rioters, while simultaneously criticizing the unnecessary use of those same measures against protestors and bystanders.
Yeah, I get having riot cops with pepperballs when there are people setting fire to police cars and beating store owners. But having riot cops with pepperballs shooting at people sitting on their front porch, or targeting obvious news crews? Completely inexcusable. I keep seeing the rioters brought up in response to these clear examples of police misconduct, and it reeks of whataboutism.
One thing's for sure, the heavy-handed response to protests combined with the ease of sharing these instances of abuse via social media has fanned the flames in a way that would have been impossible twenty or even ten years ago. We're seeing the natural results of a lack of accountability and us-vs-them mentality play out in real time for all the world to see.
Renzatic on 1/6/2020 at 17:08
So we're still in the midst of a pandemic, and now we've seen two big protests erupt across the nation. One thing's for sure, left or right, we Americans don't have a GODDAMN bit of sense.
Though I do think it's funny how the talking heads and Facebook posts have changed over the last couple of weeks. Before, you had all these people fretting over the quarantine as being a front for a government operation to implement martial law, and take away our freedoms. A few days, and some black people rioting later, these same people are now screaming for martial law to be implemented to show those people what for!
demagogue on 1/6/2020 at 17:21
Speaking of which, I guess this is a decent time to step back and take stock. So far this year we've had a near war with Iran in January, apocalyptic fires in February, a global pandemic and shutdowns, starting up in March, economic catastrophe in April so sudden we haven't even registered it for what it actually is (not to mention the armed prepper protests and 100K deaths the US has on its hands), and race riots in May.
Anybody care to take bets on what June has to offer?
I imagine, at least for the US context, this is all building up to the election in November when the real crazy may come to town if, e.g., Trump loses the election, claims fraud, decides not to step down and his dimwit cultists take his side and storm the capital or who knows what... If we even make it to November.
Renzatic on 1/6/2020 at 17:33
Considering the earthquakes being reported in Yellowstone, I'd say we're setting ourselves up for the supervolcano in June.
demagogue on 1/6/2020 at 17:44
And this may be our bon mot for the day. Trump's instructions to governors about the protests on a conference call, I guess from his bunker(?): “You have to dominate, if you don't dominate, you're wasting your time — they're going to run over you, you're going to look like a bunch of jerks.”
I think he takes 'looking weak' more seriously than anything else, if you had to boil the whole Trump doctrine down to a single thing. Who knew one little kid being despised by his father growing up could wreak so much havoc in the world? :(
Starker on 1/6/2020 at 18:36
And there's a good chance you'll have four more years of this fun, but now with a completely reshaped Supreme Court and Justice Department.
lowenz on 1/6/2020 at 19:45
Quote Posted by demagogue
Who knew one little kid being despised by his father growing up could wreak so much havoc in the world? :(
You know the story of Adolf Schicklgruber son of Alois?