lowenz on 16/7/2024 at 20:15
Quote Posted by heywood
Stefan Molyneux claimed to be a libertarian but then worked for Iran and Russia's government-owned TV networks.
I've noticed that the most authoritarian-leaning people these days seem to have passed through a libertarian phase. I have no explanation for that.
'cause libertarians love the violence applied to protect private property and the state is eager to show how wielding it. So there's this unholy marriage and you get the perfect oxy-moron (pun intended) of a statalist libertarian.
Here in Italy the biggest "libertarian" party (the "Lega") in economic terms - they want total deregulation, more than traditional far right parties - is totally pro-Putin and of course pro-Trump.
They like violence as a mean of problems resolution, apart against them and it's why they want to come to power: perfect hypocrites and perfectly happy to consciously be so.
But hey, absolutely "pacifists" (ahahahahah) when it comes to Ukraine and absolutely not when it comes to Palestine.
They just refuse the basic logic because.....that's a freedom too.
Inline Image:
https://www.sicilianpost.it/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/Trump-Salvini.jpgNicker on 16/7/2024 at 20:56
Pure gold. Thank you.
I'll say it again, I have never met a Libertarian who wasn't a closet authoritarian.
Quote:
DRIVER: Nicker, you're talking to someone who was heavily promoting Stefan Molyneux videos not that long ago. There's a pattern here.
There is also a pattern of picking through the dung-heap of legal technicalities looking for the firmest turds to polish, in the hopes that the brown dazzle will blind everyone to the fact that tRump stole state secrets, made them available to enemies of the USA, lied about doing it, conspired with others to hide them from the FBI so as to retain them and plotted to destroy evidence of his crimes.
And let's not forget that he met, in private, with Putin and his handlers, in Helsinki.
tRump has compromised generations of diplomacy and intelligence gathering, endangering the USA, its allies and, without doubt, killing an untold number of people in the process.
heywood on 16/7/2024 at 22:41
Thanks Piggeh.
I see the connection, but I question whether people like Molyneux ever were libertarian. I suspect he's one of the many paleoconservatives who played that angle when neocons were in charge of Western conservative parties.
We have different varieties of libertarians here and confused paleoconservatives are just one of them. We also have left-libertarians, business owners who hate following regulations, anarchists, preppers, homesteaders, loners, religious cults, and other people who just want to pursue a different lifestyle.
lowenz on 16/7/2024 at 23:48
It's a complex argument, "national-socialists"(nazis), "nationalistic socialists" (not nazis) and "fascists" are "socialists" in the anti-individualistic meaning of the term but also anti-collectivists (it's why they're anticommunists)
The real root of fascism is the spiritualistic form of hegelian idealism, with the result of the people seen as the body of an hyperuranic state (state=rational instance of a "divine" will, with christian traits or not)
The article in the link is "bad" because a nationalist sentiment was present in some communists too (Lenin created the Ukraine to please Ukraine antirussian communists as Putin loves to repeat and it's why ukrainians must see themselves as russians if they want to reject the soviet era in Putin's imperialistic mind - this thing is just alien for the ones not knowing well the history of the USSR and how in the initial project there's clearly the intention to
avoid the russian cultural centrality).
The real "fascist" trait is the spiritual and mythical interpretation of the reality and of the human being in clear contrast with the marxist materialism and so the "proper" socialism.
The best today approximation of fascism is the iranian theocratic republic BUT the fascist "divine will" is not a
personal one as the Allah or JHWH one, is something more neo-platonic and pervasive.
And of course the "Ruski Mir" Russia.
Fascism is more about the idea of an "empire of ultimate order" where to
integrate every human being (willing or not) than a nation with local traditions to preserve (that's just how dishonest fascists - are there honest ones? :D - sell themselves to the public).
Mussolini himself was never a "total fascist", being an atheist but he did aknowledge the power of a spiritual vision to inspire people.....just like Trump :p
Nicker on 16/7/2024 at 23:54
What Libertarians either fail to understand, chose to ignore, or deliberately distract from, is that less government and less regulation doesn't eliminate social control, it just shifts that control from elected officials and collective needs, to private interests and personal greed. This might reduce the number of laws and regulations but it just means that private interests become a shadow government. People without private property to protect have no say and those with the most private property have the most power and control.
And since the bulk of the real wealth is concentrated in an ever shrinking minority, so is the real power.
Libertarians think that being a serf in a modern, corporate feudal state, is better than being a citizen in a less than optimal democracy. That makes no sense in terms of their professed ideology.
lowenz on 17/7/2024 at 00:24
They just dream to become the next barons.
DuatDweller on 16/7/2024 at 22:30
Quote Posted by Nicker
Why do you love thieving, rapist presidents so much?
More likely that Trump will get killed by a lone wacko, radiation poisoning (they're willing to kill this dude in anyway), sudden appearance of some kind cancer.
Want to bet he won't get alive to the election day?
Vae on 16/7/2024 at 22:54
Quote Posted by heywood
Presidential immunity doesn't apply to the Stormy Daniels case because it was a personal matter not connected to his future Presidential duties and the crime took place before he was in office.
This is incorrect.
What you fail to realize is that even though the alleged event occurred before he was in office, and was a personal matter,
the prosecution introduced evidence that was covered under presidential immunity in order to prove the case.
Because of this, the judge is obligated to declare a mistrial...and the case will never be tried again, because Trump will be president or he will be dead.
The error in your thinking = *All pieces of evidence introduced by the prosecution must have come from a time before Trump was president because the event occurred before he was president*
Quote Posted by heywood
I wouldn't be so confident he'll get away with stealing classified documents either.
How do you know he stole classified documents?
