✮✮✮ !Trump Dump! ✮✮✮

Cipheron on 12/8/2022 at 04:25

(https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/mar-a-lago-trump-fbi-search-nuclear-weapons-documents-1396092/)

Quote:

Federal agents searched for documents relating to nuclear weapons and other classified intelligence information during Monday's raid on former President Donald Trump's Florida estate, individuals with knowledge of the investigation say.

According to a report in The Washington Post, the anonymous sources declined to reveal specifics about the nature of the documents — including whether or not they pertained to nuclear weapons owned by the United States or another country. The Post also stated that the sources did not indicate if such documents were located during the Mar-a-Lago search. David Laufman, the former chief of the Justice Department's counterintelligence section, told the publication that the speed with which authorities issued and executed the search warrant at the Trump estate suggested that the “material residing unlawfully at Mar-a-Lago may have been classified at the highest classification level.”

===============================================================================

Yes, there was evidence you missed: the previous raid on Mara Lago recovered 15 boxes of documents that Trump took in breach of federal law. No, there was no trial, but equally, there was no trial of Hillary Clinton. So are you gonna also extend the innocent until proven guilty thing for Hillary Clinton, or are you a "lock her up" believer?

Anyone who's that high up on the political ladder is almost impossible to charge with a crime, regardless of evidence, so the fact there was no trial doesn't mean there isn't hard proof of a crime committed. The only reason there's been no trial is the political nightmare of trying to put an ex-president on trial. You might justify it by saying Trump wasn't *very* guilty or you believe the law shouldn't be applied, but the fact is, crime is crime, illegal is illegal. You could perhaps say Trump wasn't aware he was breaking the law or inadvertently broke the law. However as they say, ignorance of the law is no defense.

(https://www.npr.org/2022/02/07/1078940308/trump-boxes-records-mar-a-lago-national-archives)

Quote:

15 boxes of White House records have been recovered at Trump's Mar-a-Lago resort

The National Archives and Records Administration NARA said it has retrieved 15 boxes of White House records and other items that were stored at former President Donald Trump's Mar-a-Lago property instead of at the National Archives.

As first reported by The Washington Post, the documents retrieved last month from the Florida property contained important records of communication along with Trump's self-described "love letters" with North Korean leader Kim Jong Un, as well as a letter addressed to Trump from his predecessor, former President Barack Obama.

According to the newspaper, keeping the boxes of records at Mar-a-Lago violated the Presidential Records Act — which requires that the government keep all forms of documents and communications related to a president's or vice president's official duties.

This was from February, so there's already hard evidence he did this *specific* crime, the 15 boxes they already found, and they got a tip off that there were more documents, of a serious nature, that they missed the first time. If the cops raid your place and find actual stolen goods, and then raid you again later based on a tip-off that you have more stolen goods, you can hardly claim the second raid was completely without basis.

Anyone else would be in prison, in fact 34 people ended up in prison due to the Mueller investigation, many of them from doing the dirty work for Trump, of which he can just claim ignorance.

(https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jun/15/capitol-attack-panel-trump-election-defense-fund)

Quote:

The House select committee investigating the January 6 Capitol attack appeared to make the case at its second hearing that Donald Trump and his campaign engaged in potential fundraising fraud, raising $250m for a Trump “election defense fund” that did not actually exist.

That's how he treats his own followers: doesn't deliver on election promises, then cons them out of their money.

Pyrian on 12/8/2022 at 04:47

Quote Posted by Cipheron

The only reason there's been no trial is the political nightmare of trying to put an ex-president on trial.

Quote:

But what springs to mind for me is the plan pushed by Trump's first national security advisor, Michael Flynn, Trump's son-in-law Jared Kushner, and fundraiser and campaign advisor Tom Barrack, to transfer nuclear technology to Saudi Arabia. In 2019, whistleblowers from the National Security Council worried that their efforts might have broken the law and that the effort to make the transfer was ongoing. The plan was to enable Saudi leaders to build nuclear power plants, a plan that would have yielded billions of dollars to the investors but would have allowed Saudi Arabia to build nuclear weapons. - Heather Cox Richardson

...On the other hand, if they have evidence that Trump was selling top secret nuclear technology to Saudi Arabia, that would... That would be bad. It would also explain a lot of things. E.g., the Saudi's recent thin-pretext transferring of billions of dollars to Jared Kushner.

Cipheron on 12/8/2022 at 06:15

Quote Posted by Pyrian

My understanding is that charges are unlikely unless someone deliberately gave classified info to someone who's not cleared to have it. Merely "mishandling" the material doesn't usually lead to charges, although this is a particularly egregious case thereof. People are saying they wouldn't have used a search warrant if there weren't charges pending, but on the flip side, knowingly leaving top secret nuclear information insecure was simply not an option.

EDIT:
...On the other hand, if they have evidence that Trump was selling top secret nuclear technology to Saudi Arabia, that would... That would be bad. It would also explain a lot of things. E.g., the Saudi's recent thin-pretext transferring of billions of dollars to Jared Kushner.

Oh yeah, for the charges thing I wasn't just thinking of these boxes of documents, but of a range of things he's done, and that at least one of them would have landed most people in prison. However mostly people around him end up in prison for them, such as his personal lawyer. We're supposed to believe that Trump had no idea his personal 'fixer' was breaking the law in order to make problems for Trump "go away".

And I did see some articles mentioning the Saudi Arabia thing, but i thought they were too speculative to mention. I did vaguely hear about a Kushner link on the video, but didn't pay attention.

I guess if we have (1) secret Saudi Arabia Trump nuclear deals, that were mentioned in the media in 2019, along with (2) Trump suspected of having stolen nuclear documents coupled with (3) his son in law Kushner getting "surprise cash" from Saudi Arabia, then we have more of a case to suspect these things are connected.

Nicker on 12/8/2022 at 07:31

Oh, snap. Poetic justice.

I'll let Laurence O'Donnell explain it.

[video=youtube;LM5H9vlH31s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LM5H9vlH31s[/video]

demagogue on 12/8/2022 at 09:14

I don't think all of the Senators were tricked. They're playing along with what's in their interest.

For the ones that aren't themselves brainwashed and would be happy to see Trump go down -- if you look at the way, e.g., Pence worded his statement, as opposed to Hawley -- it's a win-win for them: they give the appearance that they're supporting him & are anti-FBI, they get rewarded from their base for standing up to the Big Left machine, while they probably have no illusions about what's in the warrant, and either the base doesn't know what it says, then all they remember is that Senator X stood up for Trump, or they do hear what it says and are cowed into silence, and Senator X is one more step closer to helping usher Trump out of the picture without cost, and even a boost to them... Even if the base is cowed into silence, they're not going to be able to put 2 + 2 together and guess that probably most Senators knew what was happening.

That's one kind of stupid thing about this whole game. Except for this last batch of koolaide drinkers in the GOP, I think the old guard at least knows everything Trump touches is full of BS & they're playing along, whatever keeps them in power.

Tocky on 12/8/2022 at 12:43

I would have never thought of a Saudi seeking nuclear information. To me the most obvious reason to take them for Trump would be to pay Putin back for his help in the 2016 election and obtain more help in 2024. While in office I'm sure it was more difficult to pass information, though perhaps it has been while out of office as well, and is the reason he refused to give all of them back. He hasn't been able to copy and pass them along yet.

And of course that doesn't include what he has been able to destroy for his own sake.

If there had been sloppy book keeping then we might never have known about missing boxes. We are lucky to have those honest lower level officials keeping up with things. Some are stubborn in choosing country over party.

Starker on 12/8/2022 at 12:51

Quote Posted by Tocky

His death is a direct result of Republican media pushing a corrupt FBI narrative in response to their orange god being raided to get back the records he stole and claimed he didn't have.

They will not only lie for him but die for him. Cult of personality.

They want to kill Americans:

(https://www.amazon.com/They-Want-Kill-Americans-Terrorists/dp/1250279003)

Cipheron on 13/8/2022 at 08:55

Gotta love this one, the expert hired to oversee the probe into the "stolen election" in Wisconsin fired, criticized for his methods. Which are frankly hilarious:

(https://edition.cnn.com/2022/08/12/politics/robin-vos-fires-michael-gableman-2020-voting-probe/index.html)

Quote:

One case -- part of a document entitled "Cross Pollinators" and posted on the special counsel's website -- concluded that a Milwaukee city employee was likely a Democrat because she "has a weird nose ring," plays video games, "loves nature and snakes" and lives with her boyfriend although they are not married.

Lucky she didn't have purple hair or something, or he would have blown a gasket. So the only concrete evidence he got is that some civil servants have facial piercings, like video games and engage in extra-marital sex.

RippedPhreak on 13/8/2022 at 22:36

Whatever may come from this FBI raid on Trump isn't going to matter. At this point they could walk out with an 800-page binder full of nuclear weapon specs and diagrams addressed "To my good friend MBS," and "my 40%" of the country would just roll our eyes and say "Oh look, the FBI printed up another fake dossier."

On the other hand the liberal 40% of the country has already convinced themselves Trump is guilty and must be executed. (Of course, they were already convinced of this as far back as 2015). So it comes down to what that last 20% in the middle decides I suppose. If he's even allowed to run again.

And honestly he might be too scared to run again now. This is some pretty effective intimidation, right? "We can come rip apart your house any time we want, and you can't stop us. And this is only level one of the harassment we can bring. If you persist in trying to run again, we can ramp this waaaaay up! We can hit your kids' houses too, is that what you want?" I have to hand it to the Left, you guys really take state violence all the way.

Tocky on 13/8/2022 at 22:50

Quote Posted by RippedPhreak

The first part was correct. The second exaggerated. The third outright crap. There was no violence. NONE. To suggest there was is not only an obvious lie but one so obvious it boggles the mind that anyone would say it. But yes, when you steal unredacted classified material then you can expect a visit from the feds. Hell, they gave him the courtesy of asking for them first. He was not forthcoming. And then afterward he had the audacity to whine that they would not release the warrant to the public- a warrant THAT HE POSSESSED and would not release himself. Amazing.