demagogue on 14/1/2021 at 06:29
Quote Posted by Cipheron
A couple of issues there.
For the record, I'm talking about if the vote is in a few weeks or months when the new members are already seated and Harris would then be VP, because the trial itself is said to be going to take weeks, so it'd be a retrospective impeachment after he's already out of office, as I understood it. I don't think there's necessarily a constitutional bar on a retrospective impeachment, and it still has real consequences as many have pointed out (losing government support, no library, no chance to stand for re-election, etc.).
Cipheron on 14/1/2021 at 09:26
Quote Posted by demagogue
For the record, I'm talking about if the vote is in a few weeks or months when the new members are already seated and Harris would then be VP, because the trial itself is said to be going to take weeks, so it'd be a retrospective impeachment after he's already out of office, as I understood it. I don't think there's necessarily a constitutional bar on a retrospective impeachment, and it still has real consequences as many have pointed out (losing government support, no library, no chance to stand for re-election, etc.).
Apparently this information is not factual
(
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/11/politics/fact-check-tweet-trump-impeachment-run-2024-secret-service/index.html)
Quote:
A viral tweet claims that impeaching President Donald Trump for a second time would mean he would lose the ability to run for president in 2024.
That's not true. Nor are other claims in the tweet.
The tweet was posted on Friday, two days after a Capitol insurrection by a mob of Trump supporters sparked a new impeachment push from House Democrats. As of early Monday, it had more than 181,000 retweets and 725,000 likes. It says the following: "For those wondering if it's worth impeaching him this time, it means he:
1) loses his 200k+ pension for the rest of his life
2) loses his 1 million dollar/year travel allowance
3) loses lifetime full secret service detail
4) loses his ability to run in 2024
Facts First: The tweet is inaccurate in multiple ways.
1) Trump would lose his post-presidency pension only if both the House voted to impeach him and then the Senate voted to remove him from office; impeachment itself, without removal, would not result in Trump being denied any benefits.
2) The law makes clear that presidents who have lifetime Secret Service protection never get a $1 million travel allowance.
3) It is unclear that Trump would lose lifetime Secret Service protection even if the Senate voted to remove him and prohibit him from running.
4)
Even a Senate vote to remove Trump would not prohibit him from running in 2024; for the Senate to ban him from the presidency, it would have to hold an additional vote on this question. As for the impeachment trial after he's out of office, this is largely untested waters. You can be sure that they'll fight it tooth and nail to say it's not constitutional (until they decide to do that to a Democrat, at which point it'll become constitutional again).
demagogue on 14/1/2021 at 09:46
Yes, we're talking about after conviction by the Senate. What happens after a mere impeachment (nothing) has already been made precedent by Nixon & Clinton. And yes, when there isn't precedent, there's a big question mark that the Supreme Court ultimately has the prerogative to decide.
I imagine on first blush they'd ultimately decide against it, not just because of partisanship (they've ruled against Trump before), but, I mean, on the face of it it's about removing a person from office, and laws don't normally get interpreted to do something impossible (remove someone not in office). But they'll have good lawyers digging up obscure precedents saying who knows what, like if you start the process before he's out, does that mean anything?
I'm not myself too worried about it, because at this point the much bigger fish to fry are the upcoming criminal charges against him. If he's convicted of obstruction or whatever, I think that effectively does the same job that impeachment is after, in terms of souring the public to him and breaking his cult-like spell.
Oh, one thing though, what would prevent him from running again is the 14th Amendment, which prohibits anyone who participated in insurrection from running for office (Civil War related). A criminal charge for incitement of insurrection probably won't work (I posted about that above), but an impeachment on it might be sufficient to trigger that, or anyway, that's a reason to give it a shot.
Starker on 14/1/2021 at 10:27
The Lincoln Project has endorsed Mike Pence for president:
[video=youtube;L0PzmRfxvz0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0PzmRfxvz0[/video]
uncadonego on 14/1/2021 at 15:52
Quote Posted by Starker
The Lincoln Project has endorsed Mike Pence for president:
Wow! THAT was a good one! OUCH! :laff:
Starker on 14/1/2021 at 17:37
Ordnung Profit muss sein!
Quote:
(
https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/ryanmac/facebook-profits-military-gear-ads-capitol-riot?scrolla=5eb6d68b7fedc32c19ef33b4)
Facebook has been running ads for body armor, gun holsters, and other military equipment next to content promoting election misinformation and news about the attempted coup at the US Capitol, despite internal warnings from concerned employees.
[...]
[Facebook COO Sheryl] Sandberg also addressed the proliferation of hate-related content on Facebook.
“I think there's a false belief that we somehow profit, that people somehow want to see this content,” she said. “That's just not true.”
As she spoke, a “Stop the Steal” group with more than 14,000 members was still active on the platform. While that group was later removed, others have replaced it, and Facebook is displaying ads next to their content.
lowenz on 14/1/2021 at 17:51
Of course, we're talking about FB, not the bulletin board of some oratory.
"Social media" corps - like criminal organisations :p - are NOT "left" or "right". They are corps and they seek profit left AND right. What a surprise!
Nameless Voice on 15/1/2021 at 01:11
Not really; the left generally believe in more taxation on the rich and large corporations, so it's in the interests of their profits to promote the right.
Sure, they'll offer a platform to both, because that's where the most profit is, but they generally all lean to the right where it matters.
