Nicker on 8/1/2021 at 16:13
Quote Posted by Gryzemuis
But of course Wednesday was all about the jews. It's always about the jews.
Trusting that you are being ironic or some such here.
Quote Posted by Starker
Most of the places I've skimmed they no longer have the feeling of support they did when Lord Dampnut said he'd be marching with them.
That's the feeling of a bus grinding you into the pile of preexisting bodies beneath you.
[video=youtube;Jf17mXr6yEg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jf17mXr6yEg[/video]
How does it FEEEEL?
To be on your OOOOOWN?
No pardons for peasants.
Gryzemuis on 8/1/2021 at 16:26
Quote Posted by Nicker
Trusting that you are being ironic or some such here.
No, I was just a little irritated. Why bring up Hitler and the holocaust? That has very little to do with what happened on Wednesday. Yes, there were neo-nazis. Was that a surprise? No. Yes, neo-nazis are bad. Yes, the holocaust was terrible. Stick to the subject. Redneck attempting a revolution. That's eye-popping enough to talk about.
Nicker on 8/1/2021 at 16:42
Quote:
Why bring up Hitler and the holocaust?
Because of the Proud Boy with the 6MWNE shirt and the Auschwitz slogan. Because of Charlottesville, Virginia.
Racism IS the subject, among others. The vast majority of the terrorists tacitly or actively support, encourage and spread racism.
Lawrence is on point that this insurrection wasn't just a momentary, spontaneous brawl by some wandering rednecks. It was the result of a protracted and deliberate effort to undo the sacrifices made in WW2, the horrors of the American "Civil" War and the War of Independence itself.
They tore down the flag of their country and replaced it with the flag of their mad king. Make no mistake, once they install King Donald, there will be no term limits.
heywood on 8/1/2021 at 16:48
Quote Posted by demagogue
Me: I was just thinking about Venezuela and Cambodia (which I work on), because those are the two countries at the top of the list for rigged court systems.
What makes the US case so wild is, while they're lashing out insisting on that there be some "investigation into the rampant fraud. That's all we're asking for", that perception that there was rampant fraud and "there hasn't been a single investigation", and the irresponsible politicians reinforcing that belief, I feel like is driving this whole thing. But there's been over 60 lawsuits. That was the exasperating part. How many more investigations are they going to insist on?
And I was thinking, okay, in a country like Cambodia (maybe Venezuela? I haven't studied it enough), you might actually have a point that 60 lawsuits straight would get it wrong out of blatant corruption. But in the US... 60+ independent lawsuits brought to different courts in different jurisdictions with different judges and laws. Every single one throwing out the claim for lack of evidence... You want to tell me every single one was openly corrupt? All 60+, every judge at every level of appeal.
At that point you may as well believe every court in the country is corrupt down to the smallest small claims court in podunk nowhere county Alabama. If they really want to double-down on this corruption line, that's where it's going.
And that's the part that really got me down.
The level of distrust and paranoia they want to insist on is going to make every institution in the whole country suspect, and that's exactly the kind of thing that reminds me of what people in Cambodia think of all of their institutions, and I imagine Venezuela, which is a big reason why their politics is so dysfunctional. That's not a road I'm happy to see us being pushed on to.
I think that (highlighted bit) was exactly the goal of the neo-fascists like Steve Bannon who were behind this movement from the beginning. They found their lightning rod in Trump, who is an inexplicably skilled populist rabble-rouser with serious personality defects they could exploit to steer him where they wanted to go. They found support from others who had an interest in weakening our government institutions, including foreign adversaries like Russian intelligence, exploitative capitalists who wanted to pillage, white supremacists and boogaloos. I think the goal was to make enough people believe that our government, our media, and our political system was completely corrupt and under the control of our enemies that they would support burning it down and replacing it.
They, and Trump, succeeded in stealing the voting base out from under the Republican party. With Trump now exiting office, will the vestige of traditional Republicans still in politics be able to regain the leadership of the party, or will they be branded traitors and swept aside because they turned their backs on Trump? If the latter happens we are in deep shit, left with a one-party federal government and a neo-fascist party with no conscience who wants revolution.
The only positive thing I can say about the last two months is that it revealed the starkness of the choice that the Republican party faces. This week's events hopefully pulled the wool up from over the eyes of old guard Republican politicians and backers who rode the Trump train thinking he was taking them to Republican policy nirvana.
Quote Posted by Nicker
[video=youtube;Jf17mXr6yEg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jf17mXr6yEg[/video]
How does it FEEEEL?
To be on your OOOOOWN?
No pardons for peasants.
A last ditch effort to look Presidential on the way out in order to preserve his chances of running again in 2024.
SubJeff on 8/1/2021 at 16:53
Well I really don't think it was but these nuts will try to pile on as much nonsense as possible.
A lot of my friends are incredulous at the difference in the treatment of this mob Vs the BLM protestors.
And they think this will all be forgotten in a few days because America, lol.
Starker on 8/1/2021 at 17:26
Some crazy journalist got right in the front lines between the police and the wannabe revolutionaries / peaceful protestors [delete where inappropriate] and took footage. I had heard there was a woman crushed to death at the protest, but this really made it fall into perspective. The most surreal thing is probably the flag at the end (if you don't know it, it's used by right wing activists to show support for the police).
[video=youtube;0Cqy3XPS32k]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Cqy3XPS32k[/video]
heywood on 8/1/2021 at 18:25
Quote Posted by SubJeff
A lot of my friends are incredulous at the difference in the treatment of this mob Vs the BLM protestors.
It's not the tiniest bit surprising though. The BLM protesters in D.C. were opposed by a small army of federal law enforcement. Wednesday's mob wasn't opposed by any federal law enforcement. The D.C. mayor and Capitol police had to ask the Virginia National Guard for backup because the feds were nowhere. Trump controls federal law enforcement.
Quote Posted by Starker
The most surreal thing is probably the flag at the end (if you don't know it, it's used by right wing activists to show support for the police).
I saw the thin blue line flags on the news the other night too. I cynically assume they were trying to curry favor with the police as part of their strategy. But the irony of what happened at the Capitol is lost on these people. The police are only their friends for as long as they are on their side. According to a poll taken Wed evening, 45% of Republicans supported storming the Capitol building:
(
https://today.yougov.com/topics/politics/articles-reports/2021/01/07/US-capitol-trump-poll) https://today.yougov.com/topics/politics/articles-reports/2021/01/07/US-capitol-trump-poll
The one thing that surprised me a little bit about Trump's mob is that they weren't more heavily armed. Where were the militia members and wannabee soldiers when Trump needed them? That's a rhetorical question. I think we all know they're a bunch of pussy boys playing dress-up who like to talk revolution but thankfully (for us) have no stomach for it.
Starker on 8/1/2021 at 19:06
Quote Posted by heywood
The one thing that surprised me a little bit about Trump's mob is that they weren't more heavily armed. Where were the militia members and wannabee soldiers when Trump needed them? That's a rhetorical question. I think we all know they're a bunch of pussy boys playing dress-up who like to talk revolution but thankfully (for us) have no stomach for it.
Yes, absolutely. There was a lot of talk on Parler and places like that how the 6th was going to be Independence Day and how everyone needed to bring weapons, etc. But that's the kind of rhetoric they always use. There is no real organising behind it (they call it fedposting and think they are so very clever when they add "in Minecraft" to calls of violence), just a lot of hope that someone else will do it for them and they get to sit back and watch. That's kind of the inherent weak point with stochastic terrorism that you can't really control it, but only try to drive some unstable people over the edge.
There was something similar with Michigan Capitol where a lot of people were really hoping something would happen, but there was really nobody to take the lead. And when some of these armed protestors later did try to organise to kidnap the governor and put her "on trial", the FBI cracked down on them.
nbohr1more on 8/1/2021 at 19:23
Quote Posted by Starker
So let me sum it up, based on some desperate last minute right wing talking points. Those people who assaulted the police, breached the Capitol and vandalised it, who called it a revolution and said they were storming the building to drag the lawmakers out by their hair, who brought zip ties, pipe bombs, and Molotov cocktails, who wore 6MWE shirts and proudly marched under a flag of treason were basically...
a) completely justified in everything that they did (and there are calls to escalate it).
b) only following violent Antifa thugs to take some selfies and look around (because that's the best time for domestic tourism, apparently).
c) invited there by the Capitol Police (breaking down doors and smashing windows was just a common courtesy you do and tear gas is just red carpet, really, if you think about it).
d) peaceful protesters who only wanted elections to be looked into just one more time (despite never being satisfied with any of the audits of recounts).
I mean, wow, imagine what they'll do when they turn violent.
Also, seems like quite a few people are getting fired: (
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/01/07/us/capitol-riots-people-fired-jobs-trnd/index.html)
Look at that, CNN prominently showing that "people who want to audit an election are terrorists and should lose their job".
Do you know how far down 1984 road you've traveled?
What if during the 2000 Gore election, someone said "people who want to audit the hanging chads are terrorists" on Fox News?
Do you understand the precedent that is being set here?
