Kolya on 7/12/2020 at 11:50
Regardless of religion and politics most people just want to live in peace and comfort and have no interest in murderous extremism from any side. That's the only cause worth to rally behind.
Unfortunately it doesn't get the blood boiling as easily as racist paranoia or religious fervor. It requires a sober compromise from everyone.
I think every religion is nuts, but I won't make a point of insulting yours, just to prove my right of free speech and edgy humour. And I expect you to practice your religion privately and keep it out of politics.
june gloom on 7/12/2020 at 12:03
Quote Posted by nemyax
This isn't surprising. When people are used to normality and comfort, they will always oppose importing of savagery. It's very hard to explain to a civilised person why it's suddenly a fact of their life that they can have their head chopped off over a fucking magazine cartoon.
There's lots of Muslims around where I used to live and where I live now and none of them ever threatened to cut off my head. You must be doing something wrong, like calling folks "savages."
Nameless Voice on 7/12/2020 at 13:18
Quote Posted by nemyax
Deport them where? They are locals. But you could always try a Gulag for dealing with rhetoric that you don't like.
Well, presumably back to Europe, by the same logic that people want to deport families who have lived in a country for generations back to the places that their ancestors came from.
Bear in mind that almost everyone in the USA is an immigrant and/or descended from immigrants.
nemyax on 7/12/2020 at 13:57
Quote Posted by Nameless Voice
Bear in mind that almost everyone in the USA is an immigrant and/or descended from immigrants.
Indeed they are, but there are immigrants and immigrants. Note where those people mostly came from (hint: not Senegal, otherwise you'd have Senegal v. 2.0 instead of the US). Living in Ireland, you might not feel the difference. But you feel it quite distinctly if you're in Russia, where you have the EU on one side, places like Turkmenistan on the other, and places like Chechnya (nominally) inside.
Nicker on 7/12/2020 at 14:18
Quote:
...but there are immigrants and immigrants.
And then there are I-migrants. :rolleyes:
Dia on 7/12/2020 at 14:21
Quote Posted by Nicker
Trump gave the right wingers everywhere, permission to be their worst selves. He said, "See. You too can be a total asshole and crook and nobody will do anything about it".
That's what's worrying a lot of people lately. Every so often you'll get the random Trump zealot who goes on a shooting spree against people of whatever race or religion he's been taught to fear and which fear has been manipulated and exacerbated by Trump; God knows we've seen enough of that type of violence up here in Wisconsin. Though I usually laugh off the far-right wingnuts' threats of a civil war, I'm still concerned that the violence which Trump is advocating his supporters to commit will escalate if somebody with bigger balls than his aides, staff and GOP suck ups doesn't intervene and shut Trump the hell up.
'Dozens of armed people gathered outside Michigan Secretary of State Jocelyn Benson's home over the weekend "shouting obscenities" and threatening violence in an effort to overturn the presidential election results in the state, she said Sunday.' Though Ms. Benson claimed the armed 'protesters' remained peaceful (I guess because they didn't start shooting at her house?), other Michigan officials didn't agree:
'Despite Shaw's recollection of the peaceful event, Attorney General Dana Nessel and Wayne County Prosecutor Kym Worthy issued a joint statement condemning the demonstration, deeming the protesters' actions as “mob-like behavior” and said the event was not activism. Rather, it was, “disturbing behavior masquerading as protest.”' (
https://worldnewsera.com/news/us-news/michigan-secretary-of-state-jocelyn-benson-decries-protest-at-her-home/)
I mean, seriously, does Trump REALLY believe he actually won the election? Is he that far gone? Or is all of his bullshit ranting about having won the election just another effort by a man with malignant narcissism and a scorched earth policy to do as much damage to our country as he possibly can on his way out? Though some brave souls are calling for the courts to start sanctioning Trump's multiple lawsuits against swing states where Biden won, I have to wonder just how much actual influence at shutting Trump up those sanctions would have. Afaic, Trump has already crossed the line in attempting to interfere with a federal election, yet no one is doing a damn thing to stop him or at the very least, shut him up. (
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/lawyers-keep-pushing-trump-election-100001652.html?guccounter=1)
At this point I know I'm not alone in feeling bone weary of hearing Trump continue to regurgitate his claims that he won the election; I just want him to go the hell away. Ffs, he's reportedly not even bothering to show up for work anymore, except to fire anyone who disagrees with him about the election, so how TF can he even be considered our leader? Frankly, I've had it and wish to God that someone made of sterner stuff would just haul out the 25th amendment and yank that demented orange fool out of office for good. I'm not worried that Pence will continue with Trump's madness because Pence is a wet, limp washrag and the worst I think Pence will do is 'go home and pray on it' (like he did when asked, as governor of Indiana, to approve the 'clean-needle' exchange during an outbreak of HIV in that state), thereby leaving the rest of our government to get on with business. January 20th, 2021 can't come too soon for me. Ffs. :(
lowenz on 7/12/2020 at 14:22
I can obviously confirm.
Not in the little towns of course, but in the main cities.....
Those young men now old are really susceptible to Trumpism (maccarthiysm 2.0) because of those paranoia years.
It's a kind of mental reflex that here politicians uses (both wings, but the right wing really goes down to the classic "
Hidden Communists (the EU) everywhere controlling the SYSTEM".....being no real communist
left ).
Nameless Voice on 7/12/2020 at 15:04
Quote Posted by nemyax
Indeed they are, but there are immigrants and immigrants.
"The immigrants we get these days aren't as good as the immigrants we had in my grandfather's time."
Starker on 7/12/2020 at 15:41
Quote Posted by nemyax
Indeed they are, but there are immigrants and immigrants. Note where those people mostly came from (hint: not Senegal, otherwise you'd have Senegal v. 2.0 instead of the US). Living in Ireland, you might not feel the difference. But you feel it quite distinctly if you're in Russia, where you have the EU on one side, places like Turkmenistan on the other, and places like Chechnya (nominally) inside.
Irish immigrants were well into the 20th century very much looked down upon and treated as savages:
Quote:
(
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Irish_sentiment)
In 1836, young Benjamin Disraeli wrote:
[The Irish] hate our order, our civilization, our enterprising industry, our pure religion. This wild, reckless, indolent, uncertain and superstitious race have no sympathy with the English character. Their ideal of human felicity is an alternation of clannish broils and coarse idolatry. Their history describes an unbroken circle of bigotry and blood.
In 1882, five people were murdered in the Maamtrasna, on the border between County Mayo and County Galway in Ireland. Covering the incident, London-based magazine The Spectator wrote the following:
The Tragedy at Maamtrasna, investigated this week in Dublin, almost unique as it is in the annals of the United Kingdom, brings out in strong relief two facts which Englishmen are too apt to forget. One is the existence in particular districts of Ireland of a class of peasants who are scarcely civilised beings, and approach far nearer to savages than any other white men; and the other is their extraordinary and exceptional gloominess of temper. In remote places of Ireland, especially in Connaught, on a few of the islands, and in one or two mountain districts, dwell cultivators who are in knowledge, in habits, and in the discipline of life no higher than Maories or other Polynesians.
Also, yeah, I wonder what the problem is with places like Chechnya. Couldn't be all the wars Russia waged there to keep it under Russian control, could it?
nemyax on 7/12/2020 at 16:50
Quote Posted by Starker
Irish immigrants were well into the 20th century very much looked down upon and treated as savages:
Disraeli may well have had a reason to write this particular thing at that particular time, and then things may have changed. After all, there was a marked cultural difference between two Scottish migration waves that were only 60 or 70 years apart, as Thomas Sowell notes.
Quote Posted by Starker
Also, yeah, I wonder what the problem is with places like Chechnya. Couldn't be all the wars Russia waged there to keep it under Russian control, could it?
At this point (after the latest Chechen wars were in effect lost by the Russian military), it's not entirely clear who's under whose control. I personally don't think there was ever any point in Russia controlling that territory (or most of its current territory for that matter, but it's probably going to shed a crapload of that within a few decades anyway). Whatever the history, the situation is what it is. The only law in Chechnya is the word of the region's overlord. Russian law is powerless there. The ruling clan is flooded with money that's essentially tribute. All they have to do in return is turn in 99.9% for the right candidates at every election. This shit is far beyond the wildest dreams of anyone who ever fought Russia on the Chechen side.
So if you're wondering what's wrong with places like Chechnya, look at what these guys are doing when they've got it made: Boston bombings, Conflans-Sainte-Honorine beheadings and routine local executions of gay people. And total absence of any distinguished Chechen artists, filmmakers, scientists or writers in the past couple of decades. I mean Russia has waged wars on many of its neighbours (all of them actually), but this kind of 15th-century bollocks is unique.
