Advice on getting a graphics tablet?

Ostriig on 2/3/2011 at 17:20

Back in the day until some years ago I used to have some amateur inclinations towards sketching and I've recently found myself wanting to get back into the hobby, but with switching to digital means. So I'd like to pick up a graphics tablet, though, obviously not a Wacom. Those price ranges are not for hobby-driven novices.

Basically, looking for two things within up to £100:
- large active surface, 25x15cm and up;
- full compatibility with Windows 7 64bit, Photoshop CS4 and CS5;

Looking for the best thing I could get in terms of pressure sensitivity, responsiveness, the works. I see that customisable hotkeys appear to be a big selling point, prominently featured, but I don't assume that would make that much a difference for an amateur, right? I mean, keyboard's right there.

Anyway, I was looking around on Amazon and I kinda zeroed in on two options:

1. (http://www.aiptek.eu/index.php?option=com_product&task=view&productid=184&Itemid=542) Aiptek Slim Tablet 600U (-(http://www.amazon.co.uk/Aiptek-SlimTablet-600U-Premium-Digitizer/dp/tech-data/B001IX3YUQ/ref=de_a_smtd) Amazon £70):
- 254x158mm (16:10);
- 2000lpi resolution (wut?);
- 125 reports per second;
- 1024 pressure levels;
- pen accuracy +/-0.3mm;
- 2 button pen;

2. (http://www.trust.com/products/product.aspx?artnr=15358) Trust Tablet TB-7300 (-(http://www.amazon.co.uk/Trust-Screen-Design-Tablet-TB-7300/dp/B0013SQVG0/ref=dp_return_1?ie=UTF8&n=340831031&s=computers) Amazon £90):
- 305x195mm (16:10);
- lpi unspecified;
- reports per second unspecified;
- 1024 pressure levels;
- pen accuracy unspecified;
- 2 button pen;

I've seen a couple of complaints about Windows 7 support for the Trust tablet, but I'm confused 'cause even though their Amazon page only mentions XP and Vista, their own website does state Windows 7 as compatible. But that appears to be one of the few things it specifies, tech specs are woefully missing, doesn't inspire a lot of, hurr hurr, trust.

Further on the Trust, it's supposed to be able to take a full A4 under its screen protector. I know, "boo, tracing", but I figure I could have some use for it, I really like that idea. On the flipside, another complaint I've seen is that the pen is "large" and cumbersome. I also understand it can't map to a single monitor if you have a dual setup, it will instead stretch its active surface over both. Not an issue for me at the moment, I only have the one screen, but I wonder if it's not indicative of poorly designed drivers.

Of course, I'm not stuck onto those two, just what I came up with looking at Amazon UK. If anyone has a better suggestion within my price range, please link them up.

P.S. Just curious, I have a 16:10 screen so it's no issue, but how do these things map to 16:9 screens?

Renzatic on 2/3/2011 at 18:48

Wacom is pretty much the standard in graphics tablets. Even their low end stuff is usually above and beyond the rest in quality and ease of use.

For starting out, I'd recommend the Bamboo line. It "only" has 1024 pressure levels, instead of the higher ends 2048, but you won't notice that unless you're doing excruciatingly detailed professional work. I sculpt in Zbrush and work in Photoshop all the time with my little 10 inch Bamboo Fun, and I haven't had a single problem out of it yet.

(http://www.wacom.com/bamboo/bamboo_pen_touch.php) Bam. Get the $99 version to test out the waters. And even better, I think all the newer models in the Bamboo line (I got the previous version) all have multitouch and digitizer inputs, so you can use your fingers to navigate around the screen and do gestures.

Quote:

P.S. Just curious, I have a 16:10 screen so it's no issue, but how do these things map to 16:9 screens?

Just fine. Even though the tablet work space is set up for 16:10, it maps the coordinates perfectly from it to my 16:9 monitor without any lag, distortions, or deadzones.

Ostriig on 2/3/2011 at 19:19

Thanks for the advice, but I really would be inclined into getting something a bit larger. I mean, I know Wacom is king, but I've drawn out the perimeter of a small Bamboo on an A4 sheet and it strikes me as a little too cramped, but anything larger I have to look to different manufacturers. Also, on paper at least, the Aiptek above seems to have some better tech specs going for it, higher responsiveness and better accuracy. I suppose it's mainly driver support that I'm worried about.

Now all that multitouch stuff sounds appealing, but I don't think I'd be willing to sacrifice drawing-relevant specs for the sake of touchpad functionality.

And I bumped into two more options:

3. (http://www.geniustablet.com/p-10360-G-Pen-M712X) Genius G-PEN M712X (- (http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B003DQ3OPQ/ref=s9_simh_gw_p147_d0_i6?pf_rd_m=A3P5ROKL5A1OLE&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=0QSM7W9T63MMPSWW3J2X&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=467128533&pf_rd_i=468294) Amazon £100)
- 304 x 184 mm
- 4000 lpi
- 200rps
- 1024 pressure leves
- accuracy unspecified

4. (http://www.aiptek.eu/index.php?option=com_product&task=view&productid=152&Itemid=540) Aiptek MediaTablet 14000U (- (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Aiptek-MediaTablet-14000U-Digitizer-Photoshop/dp/tech-data/B000TGMI5A/ref=de_a_smtd) Amazon £90)
- 305x184 mm
- 4000 lpi
- 200 rps
- 1024 levels
- 0.25 accuracy

~~Problem is neither of them specify explicit support for Windows 7, just up to Vista.~~ Scratch that, the Genius only mentions Vista, but the Aiptek claims Windows 7 compatible on their website.

Renzatic on 2/3/2011 at 19:30

Quote Posted by Ostriig

...it strikes me as a little too cramped

You'd think that. Hell, I thought that when I first picked one up. But think of it like this: you probably move your mouse around on a roughly 2"x 2" area. It doesn't feel cramped at all. You've got enough sensitivity on your mouse to do anything you want to within that space. The same thing actually apples to the Bamboo. When I first saw it, I thought "man, that's tiny...I'll barely be able to use the thing", but bought it anyway, because I thought it'd be a good introduction to tablets. Something to use as practice, and sell off when I want to upgrade. But when I used it, it felt like I was covering a HUGE gulf of space just from moving the cursor from one edge of the screen to the other.

Granted, a bigger tablet would give me more fidelity in really small spots. But as is, the roughly 7 inch by 4 inch workspace on my Bamboo Fun feels surprisingly large, and is more than enough to do what I need to do...for now, anyway.

edit: Oh, when you check out those alternate tablets, make sure you look at the pens. If they require a battery, don't get it. They'll end up feeling too heavy, and will crap out on you pretty quicklike.

Ostriig on 2/3/2011 at 19:54

Well, regarding the size... I was hoping to avoid this but I guess there's no way around it really - (http://ostriig.deviantart.com/art/Carinna-Sennyt-134967821) this is something that I did back in 2007 (don't laugh). That's the sort of character work that I'm probably looking to get back on again, and what I'm afraid of is that the Bamboo just wouldn't offer enough space to work comfortably on that sort of thing. Wouldn't I end up constantly zooming in and out, and even zoomed out would I have the ability to do some of the longer strokes required at the thinness I need? Or am I completely off with that assumption?

Quote:

edit: Oh, when you check out those alternate tablets, make sure you look at the pens. If they require a battery, don't get it. They'll end up feeling too heavy, and will crap out on you pretty quicklike.

Feck. As far as I can tell they're all battery powered. At least they all seem to include a AAA battery in the package and I'm guessing that's not half a bonus for my stereo's remote. What does the Bamboo use, integrated rechargeable accumulator?

Renzatic on 2/3/2011 at 21:49

Quote Posted by Ostriig

Ain't got nothing to laugh about. That's a pretty good picture. You can sure as hell draw better than me, at least. :P

I can't say that the smaller Bamboo would be perfect for you, since we have different workflows. Since I mostly do 3D stuff, or stuff being converted into 3D, I have to make sure things are near pixel perfect, and generally put a tight focus on one specific area I'm working on. At any given time, I'm panning, tilting, and zooming about, from far away, to so close you can't even tell what you're looking at. I can imagine that for sketches, you rarely ever have to zoom it too much, but need a wider space to work with so you have access to the whole thing in one shot. A bigger tablet would help there, but I don't think it'd be a night and day difference. Just a little more comfortable.

I guess you should think of it like this. Your tablet is a perfect representation of your whole screen. Pressure and sensitivity are universal no matter how far or close in you are. You can do a long thin stroke that goes from top to bottom of your canvas, and still get the same results you'd get doing it super carefully up close. The only thing you'd have to worry about is your overall brush size. So with that in mind, a smaller tablet would do just as well, minus the occasional zoom-in to get tight focus on one particularly detailed area. I'd imagine any problem you might run across can probably be compensated for pretty easily.

Quote:

Hell if I know. The pens use some Voodoo magic thing that doesn't require any power. You never have to recharge them, dock them, or plug in any batteries. You just take the whole thing out of the box, slap the tablet into the USB slot, and it works forever. It's the one thing that makes Wacom tablets so appealing.

The only thing you do have to replace are the plastic nubs at the end. But unless you're doing 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, a pack of five will only set you back 10 bucks, and last you at a couple years at least. Hell, I've had mine for two years, and I'm still on the nub that came in the pen.

Ostriig on 2/3/2011 at 23:42

Thanks for all the insight, Renz! I'm gonna have to think this through. I actually folded up a piece of paper to match the active surface and I still can't shake the feeling of too small, especially since I'll likely mostly be working with portrait-style images on a widescreen format of that size. The catch is that if I have to, at any point, work with small brush sizes while zoomed out to get a view of the whole canvas, then any minor stroke is going to bring pretty broad results on the image. It would help if I could get to take one for a spin so I'll check with my former uni, but I think they only have medium and large Intuos models.

But I am tempted, maybe I really just don't know what I'm talking about and it's actually big enough for me. And if I buy it and it doesn't fit my needs I could cut some of my losses by putting it up on eBay, I guess. So let me ask you just a couple more things:
- Can you reassign some of those multi-touch features? For instance, I noticed that it uses Mac-style two fingers tap for right click, but my Asus laptop uses three fingers for that and it would help for consistency's sake. Then again, I don't suppose it has a three-finger input, does it?
- The multitouch gestures work right off the bat in Photoshop, right? Zoom, rotate, scroll, they all apply to the canvas directly?
- And since this doesn't respond to the pen exclusively, will it not throw a fit if I rest the side of my palm onto the active area while drawing?
- Oh, and this is very important, does this thing track the pen above the surface? You know, like with Intuos or those tablets I linked above, they track the pen tip up to 10mm above the tablet itself and move the cursor on-screen before you actually make contact with the active surface. Same with the Bamboo?

P.S. And thanks, but I can't take full credit just like that, it's surprising what a little underlying 3D can do for a pic's anatomy. :p

Renzatic on 3/3/2011 at 05:59

Quote Posted by Ostriig

Your mileage may vary, but it feels more than enough for me when I use it. Surprisingly so, in fact. It's hard to explain though. The best thing to do is see if you can pick one up with a liberal return policy if it ends up actually being too small. Or, like you said, you could track one down at your uni. Hands on would be the best thing to do here.

For the rest, you'll be pleasantly surprised at how well it works. Pressure sensitivity won't make a 2 px brush suddenly go 45 px. It'll make your strokes broader and darker, sure. But never to the point where it goes out of control and fills up half the canvas.

Check this video out (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyyT6MQzrPk&feature=related) here. He says he's using the small tablet in the responses below. As you can see, the guy isn't having too much trouble doing sketches with the thing.

Quote:

So let me ask you just a couple more things:
- Can you reassign some of those multi-touch features? For instance, I noticed that it uses Mac-style two fingers tap for right click, but my Asus laptop uses three fingers for that and it would help for consistency's sake. Then again, I don't suppose it has a three-finger input, does it?
- The multitouch gestures work right off the bat in Photoshop, right? Zoom, rotate, scroll, they all apply to the canvas directly?
- And since this doesn't respond to the pen exclusively, will it not throw a fit if I rest the side of my palm onto the active area while drawing?

This I don't know. I've got an earlier rev of the Bamboo Fun, which only has digitizer support. I'm guessing you can assign multitouch commands from inside the software....but don't quote me on that.

Quote:

- Oh, and this is very important, does this thing track the pen above the surface? You know, like with Intuos or those tablets I linked above, they track the pen tip up to 10mm above the tablet itself and move the cursor on-screen before you actually make contact with the active surface. Same with the Bamboo?

Yup. I can hold the pen roughly a half inch give or take above the tablet before it quits tracking it. I'm pretty sure all tablets do that, actually. If they didn't, they'd be dumb.

Beyond all this, the only thing I can tell is, if you have the choice, don't get a white one. Seriously. Even when you think your hands are clean, they're not. Right now, mine has a nice pad stain from grinding the side of my hand against the thing for hours on end.

Good luck, man. I hope you find one you like. :D

Ostriig on 3/3/2011 at 15:06

Well, I just put down the order for the Bamboo. Between what you've been saying, the video you linked, and a friend of mine who also works at the uni and has experience with these things it really looks like the "cramped" factor is all in my head. Also found another video which cleared up the touch stuff - yes, gestures should interface with PS right off the bat; no, there is not three fingers input programmed into it; and no idea how it handles palm placement on the surface, but you can turn touch off easily from a button.

So yeah, thanks again dude! I'll post back some impressions when I've made them.

inselaffe on 4/3/2011 at 00:24

Oh shit i was going to post yesterday but it appears i am too late :/

Basically, wacom only have a monopoly because they patented out the marked so that other companies were forced to put a battery in all their pens. Their patent appears to be up now - in fact a few years ago, which means new tablets are being released that do not require a battery.
In fact there was one i saw that even had tilt, but it was hard to find anything about it being released here - but it was on sale in poland or something.
In all honesty, wacom is in a market position where it can overcharge severely for what you get.

I actually have the aiptek tablet and i can say that there is no problem with it at all. You can actually change the active area of the tablet too, in order to adjust it to your aspect ratio (although for some reason by default this is disabled from the driver application - you have to edit an ini before you install).
The weight of the battery really is not a problem, it's really not that heavy or disturbing. Of course from a general standpoint it would be nice to get one that doesn't need one but still.

As for driver quality, i really haven't had a problem. The tablet also has lots of shortcut "buttons" around the edge of it, but in all honesty, i have never used them. The tablet is perfectly smooth and responsive and pressure works well.

A lot of tablets are rebranded and sold from other firms though. If i remember, i think that most are actually made by waltop. In fact the trust one might be a slightly different model / release in the same range.

Regarding multi-touch on the bamboo - i looked at that before when i was looking to suggest a tablet for where i worked (money being less of an issue), and it turns out that it does not actually have proper multi-touch hardware and so kind of "fakes it". Some of the gestures are apparently hard to get it to recognise due to this. There was an article / youtube video about it but i can't find it at the moment, can have a look later if you'd like.
In fact, any laptop trackpad can fake multi-touch with custom drivers for it that you can download.

If you can put off or cancel the order i can have a look to see what information there is about these newer tablets without the need for a battery with tilt support. They seem very decent, and to be honest i would look to get one myself if i could find one for a decent price.

Failing that, the tablet i have is actually a rebranded aiptek, sold from aldi as a medion md 85637. You can use drivers from waltop and aiptek's sites on it fine. The advantage of this is that it only cost either £30 or £40 new (can't remember which), and that was 2 or 3 years ago.
At least once a year, aldi start doing tablets in their "specials" for the week, so it's something to look out for. I think lidl might too but i can't remember.

If you really did want a wacom then i would recommend actually getting a used old intuos off of ebay or something - at least then you can get something with tilt and a large drawing area. The tablet hardware has stagnated so much over 20 or so years because of monopoly that getting an old one really won't be much of a disadvantage and would be much much cheaper. I did look into this possibility too and it seems another good option.

Anyway, any questions just ask. Sorry i didn't post sooner.