Vivian on 10/10/2008 at 09:04
A lot of my friends, including my girlfriend, are trained illustrators. One guy is getting pretty well known by doing gig flyers, but he still doesnt earn a living from it. One guy writes a monthly comic strip for imagine FX, but again, he still doesnt earn a living from it. My friends Mum was a reasonably successful childrens book illustrator but had a job as an art teacher to actually have money... you see the pattern? My gf tried for a long time, but has settled for drawing as a hobby she occaisonally gets money from and got a day job she enjoyed.
Your sisters stuff is nice, but as she seems to be finding out, talent doesn't mean you get a job. Given what I've seen in my friends, I'd find a plan B and keep plugging away at the drawing as a sideline. Maybe do a masters? It can help sometimes (although gf has a distinction MA from St Martins, which is pretty bloody spectacular, but still got zilch).
Oh, mentioning plan B's, she could actually try sending some stuff to (
http://www.planbmag.com/) Plan B magazine, they often accept stuff from unknown illustrators to go along with their record reviews. I'm not sure how much/if they pay, but it would at least get her some circulation.
Tonamel on 10/10/2008 at 09:05
1) AWESOME. Makes me think of sumi-e. Were I wealthy, I'd commission a piece right now.
2)Of course, there's no commission/freelance information anywhere on the site, so I wouldn't even know she was looking for work.
3) Not a very corporate style, which isn't a bad thing. Just harder to sell. Obviously. Has she considered illustrating a children's novel, or attempting some other aspect of the publishing industry?
4) Cafepress does her no favors. This isn't art for a shirt, it's art for a wall.
5) Maybe check out (
http://www.freelanceswitch.com/) Freelance Switch, or similar freelancing blogs. They tend to be full of ideas on how to sell your work to others. The bit I keep hearing is "Find your niche." I.e., define your field so narrowly that you're the only person at the top of it.
Digital Nightfall on 10/10/2008 at 09:14
Vivian, her "best case scenario" is to be both employed as a musician and an illustrator, and hopefully between the two of those make enough money to live off of. (She actually just got hired to an orchestra.) I often suggest to her to look for work as a concept artist rather than an illustrator, but we both think she would need a wacom tablet for that, and she simply can't afford one. I'll let her know about Plan B.
Tonamel,
1) Do it anyway! Make her an offer! :D
2) I didn't even think about that. I'll have to tell her that's missing.
3) Illustrating children's books are the jobs that keep falling through. The people doing it or hiring always seem to flake out at the last minute.
4) Most of her work isn't right for that, I agree.
5) I'll pass that along to her.
jay pettitt on 10/10/2008 at 09:57
Those are pretty neat. banging away at it for two years without much success must be demoralising. I've hired illustrators in the past when I worked in conservation to do leaflets, posters, education materials, information boards - that kind of thing. I'd be happy if someone provided work of that kind of quality. I don't think that's what is holding her back.
Ignore if this is egg sucking territory -
It's important to show that you've worked with clients, made them happy and achieved a successful outcome. In truth it doesn't really matter how pretty the pictures are, what you're looking for when you hire someone is a bod you can communicate with, that'll try to understand the situation, show enthusiasm for what you're working on, tell you what sort of time frame is involved and then deliver work that is to a good standard. Money is an issue, but probably less than you might think; if your sis can explain that the finished piece(s) represent maybe n days to actually execute with maybe a period of research, roughs, meetings with clients and so on atop of that and what with the skill involved I think you'll find people are prepared to pay a fair sum. Also of importance for both artist and client is license arrangements - whether client buys the absolute rights to the picture or whether the artist retains the original and can sell it a a gallery or whatnot. Different kinds of clients will have different ambitions there; private clients might want to protect their investments, public clients might be impressed by a more open approach. I think it's usual to purchase a license to use the artwork and if you want rights over the original to expect to pay a fair rate on top of the commission - which could easily be extra hundreds of dollars (I wouldn't necessarily go into that on the website though, but she ought to have a clear idea where she stands). It might be that Publishers which are used to hiring for book illustrations may be tougher cookies and have a pretty good idea how much they don't want to pay at the outset. I understand magazine's and such don't always pay so well, but it's good exposure and will impress prospective clients if she's got work in print, so it's always worth making the best of a job.
Obviously there's a catch 22 thing if you're trying to show you can work with a client when you're starting out - she could for example push the Cosas stuff and say she illustrated for a free software project or something and get maybe a quote from someone saying how happy they were with the results and the way she approached the project. I'd suggest that if she produced work or roughs for the books that fell through that she promotes them, makes it clear that these were commercial pieces and perhaps neglect to mention that it didn't quite come to fruition. I'd also suggest some pro bono work for a local band or a community project or some such - approach it seriously and get them to write some kind of reference/sound-bite on completion. Community projects quite often can find cash for projects anyway.
Again, specialisation is important, hopefully that will come. I don't think there's anything to be gained by trying to be all things to all people.
Also, website is important - if it were me I'd make the focus of it examples of working with clients and making them happy as soon as possible rather than a straight gallery, but you've also got to ingratiate yourself with the real world.
Muzman on 10/10/2008 at 10:21
Try getting into design maybe. Most graphic designers I've known were actually illustrators waiting for their ad firm or something to let them have a go.
Maybe the portfolio could be balanced better. From what little I recall about this kind of thing it's a mixture of creative flair and really hard technical skill. Ya might say it's already there, but there's some stuff there that a bit too shakey and getting over on style, no matter how beloved the result is. Some guy I knew of said, I think, half of his portfolio that he actually showed to people was just figure studies. I guess it depends if the job desired is of the sort "draw whatever I tell you, the way I want it" art chameleon or something else. A lot today is also pure digital and a lot of firms don't really want to add drafting tables and lightboxes and rooms filled with charcoal dust and pencil shavings to a small office. So perhaps more straight digital work.
What's really frustating is the highly skilled and capable market/area is cuthroat as hell and crowded (then underpaid and over worked). Yet most of the art in the world is handled by people who know nothing about it and do it themselves on photoshop for their boxes and paraphenalia and have no idea the art battleground or your sister even exist.
The big alternative to all of that is get together a set of those things like 'Respite' and 'mailbox' and hang them up somewhere. The local artsy gallery might not take them, preferring it to be in the artist blood or the canvasses and frames crushed during a performance piece from an irate yodeller. There's probably some smaller place selling stuff to people who just like pretty pictures will probably rep them (if local stuff is anything to go by) and then people will see it and maybe commission more etc.
Kolya on 10/10/2008 at 12:47
Buy a few good skateboards, paint them, sell them online.
Skateboarders are over-individualistic middle class adolescents with too much money on their hand and willing to give it away for anything that no one else has. Paint something vaguely sexy/morbid and you're as good as gold.
Yeah, I'm a skateboarder, did you have to ask?
Edit: (
http://www.rwtodd.net/marianna/ibi_fv.htm) That kinda style. Just needs more skulls/insects/disease.
Hewer on 10/10/2008 at 13:18
I started school in Illustration with big plans. When I saw what the life of an Illustrator would be like (pretty much as described by others in this thread), I started adding Graphic Design classes, and ended up finishing my BFA fulfilling the emphasis for both Illustration and Graphic Design.
I got started in the workforce in Graphic Design, and took on any freelance Illustration or GD jobs I could. Luckily for me, one of my Illustration freelance gigs turned into a full-time, fairly well paid job that I currently have. This is fairly rare.
What kind of schooling does your sister have? On her website she states "Studio Art"- I don't know what that means. The big advantage of school for Illustration is that you are taught how to put a portfolio together and market yourself.
In short, your sister needs to pick an area or two of expertise and develop her style. I've known Illustrators who specialize in Children's Book illustration (about the hardest thing to get into on the planet- EVERYBODY wants to do a children's book), One even was specializing in pop-up books, editorial illustration, gallery painting, wildlife, travel illustration, comic books, technical illustration, paperback book covers- there's tons, and specializations within specializations- look around.
Then she needs to put a portfolio together- and there's a real art (and business) to it. Usually your portfolio is specific to a particular potential employer or client.
After that get a copy of 'Illustrator's Market' such as (
http://www.amazon.com/2009-Childrens-Writers-Illustrators-Market/dp/1582975493/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1223643642&sr=8-1) (here) and get cracking. Be relentless. Set up meetings with Art Directors. Send out scads of mini-portfolio leaflets. Be prepared to take on jobs that don't excite you (I work full time doing screen-print art for novelty boxer shorts and pajamas- I sit and make fart jokes a lot). Network and get to know people in the industry- sometimes it's who you know for sure. Do pro-bono work for publicity, or copies of your published work. And never, Never, NEVER miss a deadline.
You (or your sister) can feel free to PM or email me if you'd like. This is really just scratching the surface to give you an idea of the kinds of things involved.
Ishy on 10/10/2008 at 20:46
There are some pretty cheap models of graphics tablet available at the bottom end of the size range. I bought a Wacom Bamboo One a few months ago for about £30 (~US$60). (
http://www.amazon.com/Bamboo-Small-Pen-Tablet-Only/dp/B000V9T2JA/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1223669809&sr=8-1) This is the closest model I can find on Amazon US. The drawing area is only postcard sized, but I was really surprised by how big that turns out to be when you're actually drawing - I'd probably be fine with half as much. The only reason I'd recommend one of the huge, expensive models would be if a central element of her style was long, sweeping curves drawn with the whole arm. That said, it's the only tablet I've ever used so my only baseline for comparison is the special hell of mouse-drawing.
Don't pay too much attention to me in general, for that matter, I'm just an occasional dabbler. I've produced some damn hot Naruto 34 though.
...By which I mean artistically challenging meditations on sexual themes in a modern, globalised cultural context.
Don't PM me asking to see it, IT WAS A JOKE.
Kin x Tayuya forever
Starrfall on 10/10/2008 at 21:30
Holy crap it's Ishy!
