SubJeff on 18/1/2014 at 08:49
Everyone knows about the old Thief games. Anyone who has read anything about NuThief will know because all the stocks mention it.
demagogue on 18/1/2014 at 09:43
They may know of them, but a good number can't be expected to have played them, which amounts to close to the same thing as not really knowing them.
It's not like making a direct sequel will suddenly make them familiar with it though... It'd still have to be rather standalone.
SubJeff on 18/1/2014 at 10:09
That's not what I was replying to though.
I agree that most people won't have played the originals but they'll know that it's linked to a series.
demagogue on 18/1/2014 at 11:17
I know, but my point was that for people that don't have any frame of reference to the originals, there's not much difference between understanding it's part of a series and taking it as something new anyway, I mean practically speaking (even if they get it formally).
I mean they're probably very susceptible to treating it as something new or who knows what kind of relationship to the originals--they don't even know--and EM's strategy plays to that, even if they abstractly have heard about originals somewhere out there, which is a variation of Azaran's point. Whatever we think about them, it remains the case EM is treating it as de novo whether their target audience has heard about the originals or not, and that's something that needs explaining.
MoroseTroll on 24/1/2014 at 05:10
Maybe. But I personally would prefer a first person sneaker.
Splashcups on 24/1/2014 at 09:05
Quote Posted by Starker
I don't think it would be that easy. Aside from his character arc having been closed off, by the end of TDS Garrett went from being a master thief to being
the master thief, from being somewhat known in the criminal world to being the talk of the town. Not to mention that he's the ultimate uberkeeper now.
Garrett has been somewhat known in the criminal world from the beginning. Remember the Downwind Thieves Guild? Quote from the Thief Gold briefing:
"The downwinders know me all too well. If they catch sight of me they'll know who took the vase, assuming they don't just kill me for trespassing."
Quote Posted by Starker
Anyway, my point was that it's not so easy as you make it out to be.
* You can't go back to the same character, because Garrett has changed during the story from "leave me alone" to "tell me more" to "I want to fulfill my destiny". This makes it pretty difficult to keep the filmnoirish aspects of the franchise.
I've been looking closely at the official trailers for anything that may tie in with the reboot/sequel idea. I first looked at Garrett's dialogue.
"This city has got trouble enough. Sickness roams the streets. Despair is everywhere. It cannot be contained with the walls that seperate us, neither can I".
"In my dreams I see her dying. I've never paid the price for anything, until now".
It seems Garrett now feels a strong sense of responsibilty to the city. The most curious thing would have to be the "Brothers of the Awakened" who are involved in the "Channeling of the Primal". It was Garrett's line "Robes. Robes are always a bad sign." that got me thinking. I searched the video for any kind of imagery that may connect them to one of the factions. There was only one thing, you see them opening a book with a symbol that is very distinctly hammerite or mechanist. The placement of this symbol seems to tie in with the central plot and could be more than just a "nod". It didn't take long to work out that the leader of the group is the Baron Northcrest and leader of the City Watch. His face is on the City Watch recruitment posters and the Thief Companion App lists him as the baron. I think that this Thief may have a "Metal Age" feel to it. With the symbol on the book, the Baron saying "The time has come for a new future. One of industry and progress above all." and developers stating that it takes place at the birth of the industrial age.
This brings me to the Queen of the Beggars, who said in reference to the baron:
"Men who believed themselves to know best, tried to control something they didn't fully understand".
Sounds to me like the baron may have found a mechanist artifact and got more than he asked for once he tried to use it. The Queen of Beggars talks like a keeper, about balance and prophesy. If anyone in the game is a keeper, or keeper type character, it seems it will be her.
"Time has moved on. The powers have shifte
"The balance has shifted. We can all feel it."
"Your city needs you Garrett."
"Time and time again it has been brought down, only to rise again from its own ashes. It is the heart at the center of the wheel. Time turns, but it remains. This time it's different. The balance has shifted. The wheel has loosened from its axis. There will be blood, seeping, oozing, bleeding from every orery in the city. Can it be stopped? Was it an empty hand without a sword, a bow without an arrow? But still, there is one who may yet be the key. To be twisted in the right lock, the right door. One who fears the light inside and as much as the darkness. Yes, he will do nicely."
On the first page of the Thief Concept Art thread you will see two pictures with quotes from the Keeper Book of Laments, the first reference to the Keepers that I've seen, though it's not much. Also, if you look at the screenshot of the graphics menu there are burrick heads on the Crippled Burrick Tavern wall.
List of consistencies
- Art/Atmosphere
- Victorian/Industrial/Steampunk/Darkness
- Character Design
- Story (Keepers gone?)/Characters (Garrett, Basso, Garrett's protege Erin)
- The City (Locations: Stonemarket, Auldale, Clocktower, Crippled Burrick Tavern, Keeper Library/Brothel)
- The City Watch
- The Eye (even with a different origin, which still has a possible connection to the Keepers, the focus ability would make sense as one of Garrett's Master Keeper abilities)
- Supernatural/Undead
- Weapons (Blackjack, Water Arrows, Fire Arrows, Rope Arrows - does anyone know about Noisemaker Arrows, Flash Bombs, Gas Bombs, Speed Potions, etc?)
FatSpy on 24/1/2014 at 12:14
Actually I am very interested in seeing how this game will turn out.
Gaestle on 24/1/2014 at 12:19
Quote Posted by Splashcups
[...]
Good post, I hope your words come true.
I would like to see more connections to the well known universe.
But on the other hand: AFAIR Montreal said there are no Keepers and Mechanists/Hammerites in the game. Am I wrong? Did they changed their mind? So I'm still waiting for the appearance of sort of pagans.
Splashcups on 24/1/2014 at 14:57
They say that they're basing the new Thief world on the lore and history of the city, bringing in particular elements to keep its essence, rather than on the narrative of the previous games. Steven Gallagher, Narrative Director, has said "We love the Thief universe. If you explore, maybe you'll find some things, which if you know what you're looking for you'll be like, wait a minute, that's kinda interesting". So we haven't necessarily been given proper info on whether they absolutely will not be in the game. It seems they will exist in some form, it's just yet to be seen whether it will be significant or not.
