Splashcups on 3/1/2014 at 05:31
Hello everyone,
I wanted to post my thoughts on the Thief reboot, as i have been sitting in the background, listening to everyone else talk. There is a alot to discuss and be apprehensive about in this new Thief title. Though, it seems that it needs to be put in simple terms for people to understand, as I've read pages upon pages of comparisons between the old and new.
The reason why everyone is dubious about the Thief reboot and most probably won't enjoy it is plain and simple. They got the rights to use the Thief name, at that point they are basicly able to say "Hey, we're doing the next Thief title. We could do anything WE, as developers, want to do. We could really be original, really think about our own ideas for a Thief game and make the next Thief into a game thats interesting, different, rather than mainstream or typical."
Instead, they have said "What are some of the features that people enjoy most in popular games?" and used that to make a Thief reboot.
So basicly, they made a funzo, or just like the guy from the focus group in the Poochie episode of the Simpsons: "So, you want a realistic, down-to-earth show... that's completely off-the-wall and swarming with magic robots?"
Plain and simple, but f*&%$"g sad. As many of us consider Thief to be the greatest PC game series ever made. It will look amazing and probably have a few decent missions, but overall its not gonna be what we want it to be.
Maybe thats why they chose to reboot it, they know they're not making the kind of thing we want. So why give us a bad sequel?
Splashcups :thumb:
GodzillaX8 on 3/1/2014 at 08:33
Quote Posted by Splashcups
We could really be original, really think about our own ideas for a Thief game and make the next Thief into a game thats interesting, different, rather than mainstream or typical."
And risk losing tens of millions of dollars.
Quote Posted by Splashcups
they have said "What are some of the features that people enjoy most in popular games?" and used that to make a Thief reboot.
And have a pretty safe bet of getting a return on their investment.
Quote Posted by Splashcups
Plain and simple, but f*&%$"g sad. As many of us consider Thief to be the greatest PC game series ever made. It will look amazing and probably have a few decent missions, but overall its not gonna be what we want it to be.
Maybe thats why they chose to reboot it, they know they're not making the kind of thing we want. So why give us a bad sequel?
No one will make a AAA game that is anything like anything Looking Glass ever made. If they ever made a System Shock 3, or a System Shock reboot, it'd be good but not on par with the originals. See: Bioshock/Dead Space. High budget games are too big of a risk to cater to a niche audience anymore. Deus Ex Human Revolution was a great game, but it still doesn't come close to the original Deus Ex. Games like Thief, System Shock 2, and Deus Ex could be made on relatively low budgets. With high definition graphics, the cost of development skyrockets. We're talking enormously larger expenditures on labor. These games take longer to make and they take far more people to make. Here's a comparison of team sizes:
(
http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/thief-the-dark-project/credits)
(
http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/deus-ex-human-revolution/credits)
This is why any game that includes high quality visuals is going to be dumbed down a bit and given mainstream appeal. It's literally not plausible to make that kind of investment for a game that people could just as easily hate. We're honestly lucky that they're giving us as much versatility and options with this game as they are. Most games these days wouldn't even consider letting us turn off almost all of the UI elements.
TL;DR: Stop expecting a AAA game to be a niche game. It won't happen. If you want a "true" Thief sequel, you'd only get one if they made it in DromEd. (Hint: Also not going to happen)
Starker on 3/1/2014 at 09:43
Quote Posted by GodzillaX8
No one will make a AAA game that is anything like anything Looking Glass ever made.
Except perhaps Arkane Studios.
Quote Posted by GodzillaX8
TL;DR: Stop expecting a AAA game to be a niche game. It won't happen. If you want a "true" Thief sequel, you'd only get one if they made it in DromEd. (Hint: Also not going to happen)
Such a defeatist attitude serves nobody. Reportedly they have already removed some of the more stupid "popular" features like QTEs. If everyone had said, "Oh well, we just have to accept it," this would not have happened.
henke on 3/1/2014 at 10:02
Yup, that's a good assessment of the situation, Splashcups.
I think the new game will be alright, but I'll agree that there isn't a lot of fresh ideas on display.
Splashcups on 3/1/2014 at 12:07
Thats pretty spot on Zilla, money plays a huge role in these developments. Except I personally think Deus Ex was a huge success in staying true to its original, even though it has high definition graphics. The action was very limited to its style of gameplay and the team who worked on it put so much love into its development.
Also, if I were to make a "true" Thief sequal, I would first attempt to update and improve the dark engine so that it could be made with DromEd. Then see if possible I could hire ex LGS staff or atleast consult with them. So yeah, its not really gonna happen that way. So many things I would do for that original coding...
But, its totally possible to have these type of classic gamtses once again. Price of development will change eventually, and the culture needs a little shaking up. Just like LGS once said, "games can be as great as any other form of art. On the same level as a great film or work of literature."
SubJeff on 4/1/2014 at 01:56
Why use Dromed? Just use TDM.
Renault on 4/1/2014 at 19:13
For a spiritual successor maybe, but not for a true sequel. You wouldn't be able to use any of the copyrighted stuff (Garrett, Hammers, Keepers, etc).
T2X should be the perfect example for everyone on whether a true Thief sequel can be created or not. It can, it just needs a dedicated team. Anyone who spouts off with "it's not going to happen" doesn't know the history of the Thief community and FM creation. And with New Dark, there are more possibilities than ever.
SubJeff on 5/1/2014 at 00:07
Meh. Dromed is too old now. The originals are great but any successor should be made in a new engine.
demagogue on 5/1/2014 at 00:45
To be honest the Doom3 engine is showing its age too. It's a decade old already. But engines are just tools to do anything within their tech-generation anyway. Whatever issues T4 may have, the engine probably isn't one of them.
OTOH the TDS engine was an issue and compromised the game some, which is why it's maybe not surprising it wasn't mentioned over Dromed, as if TDS weren't even there.
Splashcups on 5/1/2014 at 08:09
I have just been playing TDM, quite impressive. I'll have to check how many missions I can download for it.
Quote Posted by demagogue
Whatever issues T4 may have, the engine probably isn't one of them.
Exactly, the major problems that seem to exist is the fact that its a reboot. I honestly doubt any fan would of considered rebooting. Why fix something thats not broken. The game's engine and graphics are probably really awesome. What are they trying to do by rebooting? Allow creative freedom and not be restricted by the previous games? It just seems purely for gathering new fans, as it would appear more niche with 4 written on the box. We all know that people will buy any kind of crap and call it the best thing of its kind. Just look at what gets put on TV. Though, I don't see it being necessary to change elements of plot and lore in order to do that. Fans would be very happy if they didn't change story, factions, and characters and new fans wouldn't even notice the difference. I would absolutely love to hear Stephen Russel voicing characters again, however that isn't even absolutely necessary. If you watch the briefing of The Tears of Saint Lucia, the words and phrasing, its Garrett but in a different voice. Unfortunately it seems that Garrett's attitude and personality are different now.