ercles on 12/9/2007 at 08:35
Quote Posted by the_grip
Hey, if folks don't like the cheesy media coverage, just turn off the TV/Radio/Browser ffs. No need to get all shitty about it... the media is doing what it is supposed to do - make money. Enough folks buy into it and like it, so the stuff keeps coming out. i guess you could refer to the law of demand, utility, and all that jazz.
Basically, i don't really see a need to get all shitty about it either way.
It is pretty depressing that it has come to the point that people are just becoming complacent about how shite media is nowadays. In the brief time I have spent in the US I never really found any tv news that could hold a light to the ABC here, or the CBC in canada. Both of which are obviousy government funded, the ABC still is ad-free. And both of which give excellent coverage of news on a broad spectrum of topics. I know its pretty old hat to point out how bad the American media is at reporting the news, but I seriously don't buy into the concept of "if people are buying it, we should be selling it". Although I realise that it is highly naiive and altruistic, I still believe that anyone who works in the media has a responsibility to try and educate the general public.
Edward R Murrow's (
http://www.turnoffyourtv.com/commentary/hiddenagenda/murrow.html) famous speech in 1958 that featured in part in "Good Night And Good Luck" pretty well sums it up for me, especially the final few paragraphs. It is interesting to consider how little things have changed in almost 50 years.
Off the topic, I know, but I couldn't help myself.
scumble on 12/9/2007 at 08:48
Foubister, give it a rest. It's really not worth the effort.
RBJ's post makes the thread though - far too many people have taken on the whole tragedy as an excuse to puff up their hawkish stance on foreign policy or something similarly foolish.
Ultimately, unless these things hit you in the face you don't have a handle on it, and it goes for people experiencing equally horrific things across the world.
Media shite and government propaganda may have induced sympathy fatigue in many people, but, for me at least, RBJ brought it back to to some kind of "real" level.
Morte on 12/9/2007 at 08:58
Quote Posted by Thief13x
congrads captain obvious, that was hardly my point. What should people be doing? well, what would people be doing if they have the identity of some guy who murdered somone, and they know he's in texas? what if he murder 10 people? 2,973 people? does anyone realise that Afghanistan IS the size of Texas???
my point is that the fact that America is obsessed with withdrawling from the middle east IS an example of a nation controlled by the media. There's no rhym or reason, just emotion stirred up by the media.
p.s. - media prevent emotional manipulation? the media IS emotional manipulation
Oh god. Overexposure. Remember, the thing you were so upset about? Overexposure to all the terrar shouting has made people less likely to be manipulated by it. It's just boring people now.
And maybe you should be upset at Bush about the lack of bin Laden hunting, for wasting enormous amounts of resources on a completely unrelated war instead of putting them towards catching him. And withdrawing from Iraq, which is what the debate is currently raging about unless I'm mistaken, does not mean disengaging from the entirety of the Middle East.
Mikael Grizzly on 12/9/2007 at 09:08
In 2001 3000 Americans died in the towers.
Everyone is supposed to mourn.
In 1940 23,000 Polish military officers, policemen and other important members of society were murdered by the Soviet Union and thousands of others were herded into heavy labour camps. Most did not survive. The massacre has a lasting effect on Polish society to this day.
No one gives a damn.
Draw your own conclusions.
Moi Dix Mois on 12/9/2007 at 09:30
And many, many more civilians and soldiers were killed throught the second world war. What makes these Poles so important?
Of course it's no less awful than any other act in that war, but if we all felt equally sad about every human tragedy in the world we would probably just end up topping ourselves.
Matthew on 12/9/2007 at 09:31
Insert Troubles comment here. I mean, really, what's your point? That because some people weren't the only people to die in history that they shouldn't be solemnly remembered?
Edit: this was directed to Mikael rather than Speedy MDM, obviously.
Fingernail on 12/9/2007 at 09:33
About 300,000 Circassians were ethnically cleansed between 1763 and 1864 by the Russians in the Caucasus, apparently.
No one cares.
Because it's a long time ago now.
These things fade into the past - it happens. People probably didn't care so much in 1940 because hello there was a lot of other bad shit going down and Poland wasn't really in a position to do anything about what happened.
I'm not saying it's time to forget the second world war or even the first, but these things are not pressing outrages that need to be dealt with. The Soviet Union is long gone. Whatcha gonna do?
Mikael Grizzly on 12/9/2007 at 09:57
Get the Russian ministry of justice to admit it was a war crime against humanity and get everthing finally straightened out.
Quote:
Insert Troubles comment here. I mean, really, what's your point? That because some people weren't the only people to die in history that they shouldn't be solemnly remembered?
Except their deaths did not have a destructive effect on American society. The murders and deportations of thousands of the best citizens Poland had to offer before the second World War has resulted in the general dumbing down of Polish society, which unfortunately, continues to this day. They should be remembered, yes, but the impact not overestimated.
Quote:
What makes these Poles so important?
Their deaths had a highly destructive effect on my country. It's kind of like someone took 95% of the brightest people in America and shot them in a ditch somewhere in the Midwest. Imagine how that would affect.
Besides, the West still hasn't repaid their debt to Poland.
I care. By remembering and learning of their historical and social impact.
Quote:
These things fade into the past - it happens. People probably didn't care so much in 1940 because hello there was a lot of other bad shit going down and Poland wasn't really in a position to do anything about what happened.
People CARED. But when the USSR suddenly became a new ally, Great Britain and United States preferred to ignore the Polish government in exile, as well as Soviet war crimes perpetrated against the Polish people.
Hell, even Winston Churchill admitted Poles were treated damn unfairly.
Fingernail on 12/9/2007 at 10:01
Ok, I didn't mean people didn't actually care.
What I meant, and should've said more clearly, is that America can afford to CARE very openly with huge ceremonies of grief, flags waving, bombs a-droppin', in a manner in which Poland was incapable at the time.
Rogue Keeper on 12/9/2007 at 10:21
Now we are arguing who cares more. That's silly.
If the dead watch this thread they must think this is some bad comedy.
