2008 TTLG Mock presidential election. Poll included

Trance on 27/10/2008 at 02:31

How did the thread suddenly go retarded?

Fringe on 27/10/2008 at 02:39

Quote Posted by SD

But we really need the Ayn Rand weirdos before we have the full house.

By what right do you expect others to fulfill your needs?

BEAR on 27/10/2008 at 03:56

Quote Posted by Nuth

This is the least complicated election of my lifetime. If you're a redistributionist vote for Obama. If you're not a redistributionist vote for somebody else.

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iivL4c_3pck)

You are aware that this was a conversation about the civil rights movement right?

I've been thinking about this lately on the large scale, not just in terms of individual groups, and its something we tend to not think much about. We tend to want to take credit for/lay the blame for various things that are happening on the current generation involved (or at the most the last generation) involved in whatever situation. The funny thing is, everything we do builds off of previous generations, and very little of what is going on can really be attributed to the people directly involved right now.

Talking about civil rights (which is totally off topic but since Nuth seems inclined to be a dipshit its fair game), you have to acknowledge some things. America built its wealth off a lot of unsavory practices. We fucked the indians out of all their land, raped their land for gold and everything else and built a world superpower on those materials. We made incredible amounts of wealth from the use of slave labor and exploitation in the industrial revolution (as did many others). Hell, we even made millions forcing drugs at gunpoint on the chinese, something that seems atrocious now, simply because we wanted the money and we could.

The thing about that is: this wealth is still around. The money has changed hands, but the wealth and power we gained from these activities has helped us obtain the privileged situation we all enjoy now. And of course those who were enthusiastically fucked get little to no credit for being a large part of the power that we waggle in everyone's faces like we can take all the credit for it. I would be interested to look into families that have been wealthy for a long time, because I think that people underestimate what an effect that has, versus families that have been historically poor.

I'm not going to bother making an argument for redistribution of wealth one way or another, I just think its worth thinking about in a different perspective. So many seem to think of it as just a "I work hard and have to give my money to some lazy hippy", but its really a larger issue than that (to me). I think it goes back to the claim that "all men are created equal", that we are still nowhere near achieving, because in no way shape or form have we achieved such a society. You can continue knee-jerking all the way to the bank, I don't really care and I don't expect my opinion to sway you, but I cant help but find such thoughts as yours narrow minded. That is, the opinion I assume you have, since you did nothing but post a youtube link so as to say "yeah, this is how I feel but I'm too lazy/inarticulate to tell you myself". I don't actually think I know what the solution is, because I don't think opinions are the same thing as actually knowing a situation. I feel I have an idea how things should be, but since that is based on pretty scant information (considering the massive amount of information involved). I think intelligent study of the situation to find out as scientifically as possible what the optimal economic situation would be that would satisfy our ideological stance is the only way, and such a think might very well disprove my personal opinion.

I also tried to find a political science textbook online to quote but I couldn't. I know in a political science class I took a few years back it explicitly stated that one of governments jobs in terms of the economy was redistribution of wealth, because it certainly has that function whether you like it or not. Not that that is the end-all of the discussion but I still wanted to find it, but no luck.

Peanuckle on 27/10/2008 at 04:24

I hate to ruin all your excellent political debating and all, but I hope you realize that for every one of your well-built arguments, there's a redneck republican and a dumbass democrat who are voting based on nothing more than rumor, hearsay and outright fabrication.

Just thought I'd let you know.

Matthew on 27/10/2008 at 10:41

Orson Scott Card? Orson Scott 'gay agenda is killing America' Card? Honestly?

BEAR on 27/10/2008 at 14:21

OK, its official. My incredibly-republican grandmother is totally voting for Obama now. First Andy Griffith comes out for Obama and now Junior Johnson.

Quote:

Dear Luke,

Join me in supporting Barack My family and I have given this election a lot of thought.

Our country is in a rough spot, and we're going to need some serious change. There's only one candidate ready to deliver it -- and that's Barack Obama.

Every day I talk to someone else who's never voted for a Democrat, but now they're voting for Barack Obama. They realize that Barack understands what we're going through here in North Carolina. And they're ready for change.

So I've made up my mind, and I'm ready to get involved. I know that I could never have won a race without my pit crew, and I know Barack can't win this one without us.

...

When I talk to folks about why I support Barack, I just tell it like I see it.

There's been a lot thrown at him this election, and he's stayed calm, positive, and focused. I know a little something about how important it is to stay cool under pressure.

And with all the dangers in our world today, that's the kind of rock-solid leadership our country needs.

These days, I run a small country ham and pork skins business. Barack Obama will fight for a fair economy where small businesses like mine have the freedom to grow, and he'll defend the Second Amendment to protect the hunter's way of life.

But the most important reasons I'm speaking out for Barack Obama are named Robert and Meredith, my two children. My wife Lisa and I talked it over, and honestly, we know in our gut that their future is more secure if Barack Obama is president.

At the end of the day, there's just nothing more important than that.

That's why I'm going to talk to my neighbors this week, and I'm asking you to do the same. This election in North Carolina is going to be one of the closest ever, and we all need to lend a hand.

...

I've been in a lot of races in my life. But this may be the most important one of all. So let's all get in gear and win it together.

Yours,

Junior Johnson

P.S. -- I know what it means to run an aggressive race, but I also know what it means to compete with integrity. Have you gotten one of these pre-recorded calls that are flooding our state smearing Barack Obama's character and questioning his patriotism? That's crossing the line, and North Carolinians deserve better. Help fight back by canvassing this week to tell your neighbors the truth about Barack:

I know this is a campaign promo and they want me to donate (again) and/or volunteer, but still. This is a very famous guy in this area and an endorsement like this will be pretty hard to ignore.

Turtle on 27/10/2008 at 15:43

I think it's cool that Junior Johnson is your grandma.

Stitch on 27/10/2008 at 15:52

The worst thing we liberals can do is get complacent and smug, but this is basically over. Polls have more or less remained static since the last debate, indicating that people have made up their minds. There's really nothing McCain can do at this point to salvage his bid for the White House; there's eight days left and nothing that he throws at Obama is sticking.

This is probably the best thing for the Republican party, really. They can go away, lick their wounds, and re-emerge as a leaner, more disciplined alternative when the Democrats get overconfident and reach too far, as tends to happen when one party rules across the board (Judicial not included).

As someone obsessed and involved with this election, I have quite a bit to say from a post-mortem standpoint, but I'll save that for when this election actually is over.

Queue on 27/10/2008 at 19:02

Quote Posted by io organic industrialism

I'm blaming you when we all die in a nuclear attack because John Mccain is a hotheaded warmonger

:(

That's pronounced "newk-u-lare"--get it right next time, or else we won't forget the gravy.

Turtle on 27/10/2008 at 20:17

Wait, I'm uncyuler on this whole pronunciation thing.
How's it go, again?